Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Neal — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 12:59:37 GMT

When we look back this will be a parallel to the 1936 games in Munich. Of course, no one in China will ever see this reporting because it will be consored via the great firewall.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Sono — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:08:54 GMT

I'm still trying to figure out why China was given the opportunity to host the Olympics in the first place.
No one should be surprised that they're back peddling on almost every single one of their promises with regards to press freedom and television coverage. Good Luck getting a live shot unless you planned it and filled out paper work last year...what a joke.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

JB, Texas — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:20:19 GMT

There's nothing wrong with national pride. We Americans seems to believe that we're the only ones who should have it. My advice to the cameraman: Stay off the table. It's bad manners in any country.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

J. Atlanta, GA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:24:04 GMT

There just seems to be a tension here between the nationalism of the Chinese people and the actions of the government. The very next story on MSNBC is about a teacher who was sent to a labor camp for a year for taking pictures of the shoddily built schools that collapsed in the earthquake. The Chinese should be proud of their country and rich culture, but as a rising economic and political world power, don't they have a responsibility to put their house in more order as well?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bill M Albany NY — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:35:24 GMT

I still won't watch the games. Between Tibet, Tiawan, and the sale of organs through exucution of political prisoners China makes the rest of the world look good. Then toss in the lack of repsonse in the Sudan to the genocide which China's government profits from oil revenues from that country.

But hey, i am just a blood thirsty American, right?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Gene, Bostn — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:38:44 GMT

There's little doubt that China will use it's population numbers and growing economic and military might to push the rest of the world around. Their reaction to the world's demonstrations against their crackdown in Tibet was *amazing*. (They said the WHOLE WORLD was wrong and they were right!) That was a pure illustration of the national insanity that prevails there. They cannot be trusted to be a benevolent world power. They have shown, time and again, how little regard they have for equality, human rights, rights of minorities and concern for other nations. Their Will to Power won't stop with the Olympics; it's only the tip of the iceberg. They're fanatic about being on top and owning it all. Helping keep peace in the world won't be a big priority with them--unless they feel threatened. (If we need to keep our own military might aimed anywhere, it's at them. These people are CRAZY.)

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

PJ, Chicago — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:40:19 GMT

When I read this story, I see many parallels between the patriotism in China and that in the US.

Virtually every one of the statements in this article could be talking about the American people.

Calling anti-war protesters 'unamerican' or lashing out at any foreigner who criticises America.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

harold stassen, des moines, iowa — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:46:27 GMT

the nazis put on a hell of an olympic circus, too. why are we crawling on our hands and knees to these people? maybe the opening ceremonies isn't the only chinese knock-off product americans should be boycotting.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Not Your Typical American — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 13:47:30 GMT

This article like many recent articles trying to analyze the recent revival of Chinese Nationalism often refer to "perceived humiliation". Obvious they haven't study any recent Chinese history or they just choose to ignore historical fact for their purpose. Starting from the Opium War with the British in 1840 when China had to concede Hong Kong to England (try to image conceding New York City to a foreign country), to the 1860 war in France, to the Boxing Rebellion (where the western powers and Japan invaded Beijing and looted the capitols (trying imaging the British burning the White House and looting Washingon DC).
Where else do you find a country where you laws of your law DO NOT apply while foreign laws apply. Try thinking of a sign in New York City that shows "American and Dogs not allowed".
These authors should have a sense of history to see Chinese patriotism from the other side. These are same authors who give the western media a bad name.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Derek — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:01:03 GMT

I love the olympics game coz when i reminize how Nigeria took the olympic trophy in 2004 i was amaze,try an make it a reality because it will attract all the country in the world.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

DeJay, MI — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:02:13 GMT

PJ said: "When I read this story, I see many parallels between the patriotism in China and that in the US.

Virtually every one of the statements in this article could be talking about the American people.

Calling anti-war protesters 'unamerican' or lashing out at any foreigner who criticises America."

But we don't put people in prison for criticizing the gov't.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

james melton — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:08:41 GMT

i have spent time in china, married a lovely chinese lady and now consider China to be my other home. I love America and take pride in being American as well as having ties to China. When i am in china i show respect for thier country and always remember i am a guest and act accordingly. If everyone does this during the olympic games it will be a great event. YES this article can be read in china. I have been there and on the internet. YES they do block some incoming but it probably should be blocked anyway.Don't talk to me about censorship we have pleany of that here it is just called another name.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Seth Henry, Peoria Illinois — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:15:25 GMT

These games are important to China and they well should be. Despite human relation problems in China, tell me what country in the world hasn't made similar comments about us in the U.S. China is proud for once but the average Chinese citizen has no say in how the country is run. The only thing they have is pride to show when things go well. China's government in many ways is the irresponsible one but has made tremendous leaps in change. Now if only the government could change its environmental stance of consuming as well human rights so there are fewer human rights violations and fewer celebrations with young children doing a dance for oil. It is a nation emerging into a world it has not been part of, they, like us, will learn what it takes to be a part of it. They want to be part of it for once. China will need to learn these things quickly though. Its rampant growth and increasing demand on limited natural resources(as encouraged by the government) could kill its buzz quicker than any comment by an outsider.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Robert, Minnesota — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:17:14 GMT

Bah, life is cheap in China. Of cheap things it is the cheapest. Of no importance is the individual. Not with such numbers as the Chinese.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Robyn — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:19:05 GMT

I would like to echo the perfectly put comment from JB of Texas just below:

"There's nothing wrong with national pride. We Americans seems to believe that we're the only ones who should have it. My advice to the cameraman: Stay off the table. It's bad manners in any country."

Yep this is really true. And I'm suprised that Ms Mong was willing to advertise her camerman's lack of professionalism. Really man, next time if you need to get a higher angle for your shot bring a step ladder with you.

That said, Ms Mong did bring up a very important observation at the end of her article which really explains the kind of over reaction the Chinese population sometimes has to a rather small slight. From China expert Orville Schell writing she quotes a
China-born filmmaker as saying: "We Chinese carry the burden of our history with us and the question of Western humiliation is always unconsciously inside us…. There is something almost in our DNA that triggers automatic, and sometimes extreme, responses to foreign criticisms or put-downs."

This is true and it makes them hypersensitive. The average every day Chinese is coming from a very different place than we Americans are. They are in a growth phase now, coming from memories of a humiliating past. If/When they are not over sensitive any more it will only mean that have had success in their growth as a nation. That success will not only be in wealth and standard of living, but also in a more democratic political structure.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Shamefully American — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:21:00 GMT

I'm definitely amazed at the amount of Westerners who know absolutely nothing.

But then again, you are American, I suppose it is excuseable.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike, Kennesaw, GA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:21:12 GMT

I hope the smog is nice and thick. It would be the biggest embarrassment to the Chinese government.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

di, cincinnati, oh — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:24:02 GMT

I have said from the beginning these Olympics were less about China showing off to the world and more about the Chinese government using this to boost their image to the Chinese people. It is nothing more than propoganda for the government. It is amazing how the average Chinese person views these games, and do not dare to mention the smog or other pertinent issues to them.
Watch for massive ugliness if there is a close decision on the winner of an event between a non-Chinese and Chinese competitor and the Chinese competitor looses.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Geoff, Chicago,IL — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:25:46 GMT

This is to PJ from Chicago. The Chinese nationalism being displayed by their population is more akin to US nationalism during WW2, but not now. Gone are the days of "Loose lips sink ships" and "When you ride alone you ride with Hitler." Also the US propaganda in WW2 was in response to foreign military aggression (either actual or embellished), but China's propaganda is in response to the government taking advantage of a rising economy and nation-wide "self esteem." You might argue there is a percentage of US population that will blindly oblige the actions of the government, but there is an equal (if not greater these days) percentage that will criticize it. In my understanding that differentiates the US from China.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Macho Man, oo Yeah, Wash — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:27:07 GMT

China is a large dump due to it's horrible "Government" I feel sad for it's people who for the most part are nice, kind, family first people. To bad Their "leaders" are self-centered guys who pretend to listen to the population but then turn around and do what ever they want for their own gain......wwait...I've forgotten who I was talking about....

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike H from Chicago — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:30:26 GMT

To Bill M. from Albany. I think you're an typical arrogant American. Being an American I can tell you that White people are very comfortable pointing the finger at Chinese people. Any excuse to express your deep-rooted racism.

You're concerned about Chinese record on human rights? These are rights you wouldn't give to these people if they were here in the US. You'd call them aliens, or foreigners, and deny them other human rights.

You are a aptly named a HYPOCRITICAL bloodthirsty American

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Geoff, Chicago, IL — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:32:51 GMT

James Melton said
"YES they do block some incoming but it probably should be blocked anyway"

If at any time you feel you have too much freedom, by all means, there are several choices at your disposal. You should be blocked.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Alex, Htown — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:35:21 GMT

"Calling anti-war protesters 'unamerican' or lashing out at any foreigner who criticises America."

Hardly a valid point since 75% of the country officially opposes the war now. You're talking about an incredibly small percentage of the population doing this. Thats the difference between America and China: healthy debate and internal conflict. Whatever the issue, you're bound to have someone on every side of it in this country. In today's China, it's scary to me how one-sided and conforming everything is. Everyone seems to be falling in line and rallying around the flag, while the government commits countless atrocities in the name of "cleansing" the city, when it is this very act that is trashing China's reputation.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Joril, Hefei, China — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:37:28 GMT

Hey, guys, come to China and stay for couple of days with ordinary people here, you can see what the author's talking about is just half true.
True is every decent citizen loves his own country, that is, patriotism lives inside everyone's heart no matter whatever his natioanlity is.
Untrue is this sense of pride is not just so-called 'nationalism', it is a natural expression of joy with such a grand feast.

My question to the author is, is Chinese people's hilariousness making you uneasy in some way?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Slinky, Chicago, IL — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:39:26 GMT

Why so many sour, bitter notes about a few positive images of China? It is really not necessary. Enjoy your day, enjoy the games. There will be a lot of American wonder stories from this game too.

Are you really care that much about human rights in China? or just because you were fed too much stories about Chinese stealing American jobs? This story may bring you some comfort: your iPod is made in China. You pay $300 for it. Apple makes $80 profit off it. The Chinese factory owner makes $3 or $4 profit. I even don't know how much the guy actually made your iPod.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike H from Chicago — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:39:52 GMT

From Neal:When we look back this will be a parallel to the 1936 games in Munich. Of course, no one in China will ever see this reporting because it will be consored via the great firewall.
Neal (Sent Wednesday, July 30, 2008 8:59 AM)

I like how the parallel is drawn between them and the nazis from some white kid. First of all it was Berlin you ignorant bastard.

Second, please note that Germans are aggressor combatants in TWO world wars. but because they are white, they are ok. they aren't nazis, they are good German people. BUt CHinese, noooooo. They are evil. all of them. right?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

DM, NY — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:41:01 GMT

Seems just like the 1936 Olympics. The internet and other media outlets censored, while foreigners closely watched and monitored all in the name of the Olympic spirit. China has no intend in going the free world, they are going to make us join their world.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Lazy Harp McGee, Phoenix, AZ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:41:11 GMT

Turn off the games on your TV, that's what I will do.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike H from Chicago — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:41:33 GMT

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike H from Chicago — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:44:49 GMT

ALL AMERICANS ARE RAISED FROM BIRTH TO HATE CHINESE PEOPLE

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Alex — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:45:33 GMT

to Neal:
I suppose you don't know the real situation in China, which is quite different from the past.
We Chinese can freely surf the Internet sites, including many of those oppose the China Government.
So, before you make any comments on China, please investigate adequately.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

John Doe, Seattle, Wash. — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:48:13 GMT

I'll proudly avoid every single second of Olympic coverage. I detest the Chinese government and hope these games fail miserably. I hope the Chinese government is completely humiliated in the process.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Rob, Coatesville, PA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:51:18 GMT

I've visited China many times. Most Chinese are extreme hypocrites. The CCP's position is that it's ok to criticize everybody else, but, you can't criticize the CCP (Central Communist Party). All those black Audi cars you see are for Party members, not for the people. And, you should see how the corrupt CCP officials waste money in restaurants. They (CCP members) actually enjoy flaunting their extravagant spending in front of the poor. The rural farmers' annual income is less than $500.00 per year. So, the West says that China is a developing nation. Yet, the Chinese government is spending billions (soon to be trillions) on military expansion and space exploration programs (screw the farmers!). Unfortunately, these problems are actually the fault of the West. Corporate American and corporate Europe continue to outsource manufacturing in Asia, which has significantly undermined our own economic stability and industrial capability. And, let's not even talk about the massive amount of technology transfer that has occurred over the last 30 years. The US government allows the Chinese government to purchase real estate and businesses in America. In China, nobody can own land. Rather, you must lease the land from the government. For some strange reason, most westerners tend to believe that Chinese people are extremely polite. That's simply not true. In my experience, Chinese can be some of the rudest and filthiest people on the planet. It's common to see Chinese people spitting on the floor in a restaurant, hotel lobby, or elevator. No wonder Asia is the breeding ground for influenza! It's not uncommon for you to be talking with hotel staff, and a Chinese person will butt in front because he/she wants to be served first (a common practice in the airport too). The west has given China enormous wealth and opportunity for advancement. China repays us by selling us poisoned food, drugs and unsafe toys. China! Thanks corporate America for selling us out. But, who's really at fault? Corporate America's extreme greed, or China's extreme greed?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Joshua, pittsburgh, pa — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:51:24 GMT

This article clearly shows the ignorance and arrogance of American journalists. Jumping on a table in front of a crowd is not considered a good manner in China, particularly a guest. A journist is not a king. Please don't behave like he owns the place. Talking the chinese suffering in the recent history so lightly is simply equivalent of talking to jews that the holocaust is just a perceived controversy. This journalist has to be a little more sensitive.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Phyuk Yiu, Sichuan Province — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:56:20 GMT

@ Not Your Typical American, et. al

The thing is the White House WAS burned down by the English and D.C. was looted, ever hear of the war of 1812? Also "its called respect" for other countries, why should Americans respect other countries when the majority of them don't respect their own? The Chinese might in fact have the right of it, clamp down on personal freedoms stamp out individuality and force collectivism on the populace and the result is a happy people. Unless of course that study conducted was skewed towards a pro government stance, but that could never happen right? The "media" is always unbiased and non-ahenda driven right?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

May Lee, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:59:58 GMT

As you mentioned in this article, 86% Chinese surveyed are satisfied with their government and their way of life. Doesn't this say something to those China bashers? These foreigners think they care more about China and Chinese people than the Chinese themselves, and they are here to save the Chinese. What an arrogance and ignorance! Remember, Chinese do not appreciate your self righteousness. Don't you know not to tell other people (or country, etc.) what to do? That's human relation 101, right?

In the last two decades, China has lifted 1.3 billion people (over 20% of population on earth) out of poverty. Tell me another country in the human history able to achieve this magnitude. China and its government deserve respect and appreciation, instead of nit picking and unfair treatment.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

oea — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:03:17 GMT

I will watch the games. Only stupid people (a few amongst the commentators) would link this Olympic with the Nazi's, and yes China cracks down on Tibet, because they conquered it 600 years ago, we crack down on Mexican immigrants through the Southern states, and we only conquered it 150 years ago. They don't pressure Sudan because they need oil, the same way we didn't do nothing to the Shah of Iran (oil) and Chilean dictator Pinochet (cooper), and still don't do it today to Saudi Arabia, which still denies women all kind of rights, decapitates prisoners in public view, and prints school books explicitly preaching to fight Christians and Jews, so every major power plays by its own interest, and yes, we Americans are probably the most nationalist pricks of all, so watch the games or don't; but please shut up.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jim Tinerman — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:05:13 GMT

Interesting. I didn't know that most Chinese support their government these days. I still have the image of the single student standing before that tank.

It shows that either I'm not paying attention when I watch the news and read the news daily on NYT, MSN, and Yahoo or that the the political situation in China is not being covered well enough in the US.

I'm wondering if Americans are just not that well liked in foreign countries these days.

Regardless, I'm axious to see the games go extremely well and hope that the Chinese government and its people will welcome everyone.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Barry J. S. Liu, Watertown, CT — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:08:53 GMT

Certainly, a majority of ordinary Chinese people, likewise,a few American, do possess that kind acidic, aggressive view of patriotism. Except that the voice, in China, of liberal, progressive, and tolerant viewpoint is nowhere to be found. It reminds people of the fanatic movement of the Boxer bandits' disaster that brought down the last dynasty of China. "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel." (by Samuel Johnson )We must keep scoundrels at bay whether they are American or Chinese.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

oea, Tampa FL — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:09:32 GMT

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Deborah Richardson, Anchorage, Alaska — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:10:37 GMT

Why did they choose China for the games this year, when they knew the air quality was so bad? Who can really perform to their best, when they are having problems breathing. China is so big that they should use some of their money to clean up their air.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Robert, Phoenix AZ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:11:42 GMT

There's a lot of stuff said in these comments that makes me mad to be an american. And i love being an american. i love america and all that it stands for. And i'm definitely not going to hold a grudge against someone from a different country who shares my views in their own location. Yeah, China has problems, but so do we. They've got mud on their name but so do we. To boycott an international event simply because its being hosted in a country thats less than perfect is ridiculous. To trash talk a country makes us hypocrites no matter what you think of this country. So before you make a comment to bash China because of all the "evil" things happening there. Think about your own national image. Think about the Olympics and what they signify. It's not just an international competition, its a symbol of international unity. Come on people, we're americans. If we think we're so great why don't we work harder to let the rest of the world think the same thing?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Brian L, Long Beach, California — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:11:53 GMT

I think it is odd that Americans stick up for China. It seems strange that our sworn enemy is our buddy all of a sudden. I also find it strange that naturalized Chinese-Americans are being caught frequently stealing technology and trying to sell it back to their homeland.
This problem is caused by xenophobia folks. It is not a temporary phase, The Chinese have almost always been "against" everyone else. It may have been morally wrong to exclude the Chinese from american shores in the 1800's, but it was a pragmatic concern we should revisit.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

J Gleason — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:12:49 GMT

Why can't people separate the Olympics from the host country? Come on, it's still about athletes from all over the world first and foremost and making the world a "better family."

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Olympic Fan — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:12:57 GMT

Neal- The 1936 games were in Berlin, not Munich.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

nicole, cambridge, MA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:13:47 GMT

i don't understand how we americans can write articles like this, criticizing the same flaws in another country that we clearly have. Of course our fallback is always, we're democratic, they're communist. Our reasons for war are to spread the seeds of democracy, our censorships is only a means to filter dangerously undemocratic thinking...pretexts, illusions, but hey whatever right?

how can ANYONE on this wall say what life is like in china if none of them have lived there? well clearly, we ALL know that china is a place where no one can talk without fear of the impending march of the red army. Clearly in every chinese household, is a shrine to the late mao. Clearly this is all true and oh...clearly america is the model of perfection against all that.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

OMEGASECTOR — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:15:16 GMT

well what about the chinese carring out industrial espionage and spywarfare esp in u.s? there are literally thousands of chinese spies in u.s loyal to their regime even a common chinese citizen is a spy if nobody never knew.why cant c.i.a detact quickly the spies in tech and defense companies.china is a curse to the world,they accomodate and sponser maoist rebels in india and beware china is the root is genocide in darfur.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mel Robinson — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:18:16 GMT

No, our Government doesn't throw people in jail for criticizing...they just make them "disappear" once they become a little too "loud" with their thoughts...

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:19:16 GMT

(trying imaging the British burning the White House and looting Washingon DC).

Ever hear of the war of 1812?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

MGO, Chicago — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:20:05 GMT

When citizens of other nations show pride for their own country it's called Nationalism with negative connotation. When Americans do the same thing, the better sounding word, Patriotism, is used.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

ZL Lin, Subang Jaya, Malaysia — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:20:13 GMT

To Gene of Bostn.... Western Europe and North America is not the Whole World. The Whole world support Beijing Olympic....Africa, Latin America, Middle East, Central Asia, Asia, E. Europe, Russia, East Asia, South East Asia etc. China gives inspiration to us. That even a 3rd world country, can be the best.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bobby — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:22:34 GMT

Living here in the US, I noticed that Americans are probably more Nationalist than any other people especially after 9/11. Just look at the flak Obama caught for not wearing a flag pin. I know, as the undisputed hegemon, what we say goes, but is it okay for Americans to be Nationalistic, but not other people?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Rahul Mishra,Newdelhi.India — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:24:35 GMT

There is nothing wrong in feeling proud
of one's own country and China is no
exception.Olympics in China is a national
missiom and the entire country is dedicated
to it, as the US was dedicated to the moon
mission.
The problem is not the nationalism, but the
lack of political reform.The only political
party relates every thing to nationalism,
like the goverments of middle east relates
every problem to the west just to save there neck.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Joe Owen, Riesel, Texas — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:25:37 GMT

I think it is almost tragic for China to pass up on historic opportunities to have a true dialgue with Tibet and Taiwan. China has to realize that the issues involving these two countries will not go away with "Olympic Spirit" but will remain troublesome for years to come.
How would China react if athletes on the medal podium took out a small Tibetan flag during the playing of their own national anthem? Would true olympic spirit prevent China to NOT crack down on these protests?
China has to realize that the world is looking at them for at least the next month with a "telescope". Will China change? Who knows......

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Micheal Kilpatric, USA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:26:52 GMT

To be honest with you, I also had thoughts of the Munich games in 36. But everyone is entitled to thier opinion, which is obvious above. Now, that being said, I think it is important as a human species to realize that no one country is perfect, nor defined as a "people" by the actions of history, or we would all be in trouble. America was started as a prison. People that were sent here were the worst of the worst. As a people, we turned it around, albeit slowly, and with a lot of growing pains.
China has been a country that all others have constantly degraded and despised. As pointed out earlier, their laws for centuries were not really there own. It was likened to someone taking over areas of our country. It would make us mad, it made them mad.
We as a society have to be understanding and tolerant of every other country out there. Are we better as a people than some? I am sure. Are we worse? I am sure.
No one is perfect.
The people in the news try to put themselves above most customs, becuase they are always looking for the next story, the next image, the next video. They need to think before they act in many cases, and issues would be avoided in most cases.
Chinese pride is huge right now, because they have been downed for over a hundred years (look at what we did to them in the "Western Frontier"), and now the one symbol of unity through competition is in thier land.
Don't fault them for what they say, it's their country, and at the end of the day, they think what they want too, just like everyone else in the world.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Robert Las Vegas Nevada — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:29:41 GMT

To Not Your Typical American,

"to the Boxing Rebellion (where the western powers and Japan invaded Beijing and looted the capitols (trying imaging the British burning the White House and looting Washingon DC). "

Read your history. They did do exactly that in the War of 1812.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

george white cottageville,sc — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:29:41 GMT

I'm surprised you can take a picture with all the pollution and algae over there anyway. Good Luck to our athletes.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

do as god like — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:34:21 GMT

please, don't let the "hate" full of your heart, for GOD sake.

God love everyone , right??!!!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Rod Wolf — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:34:45 GMT

Do you remember the 1936 Games in Berlin? The showcase of Nazi power beaten to a pulp by an injured Black-American hero named Jesse Owens.. This time it's the Asian remake. In the end, you be the judge... Peace..

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Chuck -Iowa — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:34:48 GMT

I hear comments like the Chinese are new neighbors on the street," Should we take oatmeal or chocolate chip cookies over?" These are the same communists that they have always been, who kill people or make them disappear if they diagree. Their people hate communisim as much as anyone but they have learned how to stay alive,AGREE WITH THE STATE-ALWAYS....So if your gonna get sucked into believeing the propaganda ["We're just a peace loving people"] just know that your siding with and helping the killers.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Tate Miller, Monterey — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:35:05 GMT

Nationalism of any ilk is divisive and arcane. Take pride in being a global citizen, not in being American, or in being Chinese or in any other ethnic origin. The only way to save our planet is the eventual dissolution of national boundaries, not delineating them through national pride.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

John C, Seattle, WA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:37:47 GMT

Deep rooted inferior fixation is shown through the demonstration of 'national pride'.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mark Cowan — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:38:23 GMT

Some of the descriptions above by Americans of China definitely fit the United States as well. How easy it is to criticise other countries like China when we need to look in the mirror at ourselves. We need to remember that it is because of our arrogance that China now holds the government bonds and bank bonds that cover much of our Debt including morgages. We condem them for thier response to the situation in Tibet, but think of what our government did in IRAQ, Vietnom and what we would do if any State onf the United states did the same as Tibet. Does anyone remember the Civil war?The fact is they are the larges country in the world, and we have ignored them for the past 60 years, so what do you expect. Lets hope things work out well for them with the olympics. Afterall we had our own problems in Atlanta and the workld didn't say we shouldn't have them here aagain. Mark in PA.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Tom Que, Princeton, NJ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:38:27 GMT

I love the Olympics game too and enjoyed touching moments when athletes play. I doubt why the producer Adrienne Mong using the term ‘NATIONALISM GAMES’, obviously it’s an INTERNATIONLISM GAME. I love a pure, clean game rather than a dirty political game. I love both China and USA, and two of my American friends are planning move to China after the Game. Enjoy the Game, no wars.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Peter, Coconut Creek, Florida — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:39:46 GMT

I also intend to boycott these games, since that idiot in the White House won't. I feel sorry for the atheletes, especially those that must compete outdoors in the smog. The reason China was awarded these games is simply "money". They have the most excess capital of any country, especially the U.S. Their economic clout is being used to build their military and civilian infrastructure, while the U.
S. is spending a fortune in Iraq ( a nation about which most Americans couldn't care less ).

Ignore the games, and perhaps the networks will also next time they are held in such a repressive and hypocritical nation.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

John, Moapa, Nevada — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:40:08 GMT

China scares me. They are increasing missle production. More Chinese subs are "heard" in the water than Russia (when it was the Soviet Union) ever had. Though their economy is growing and their capital city suffers from L.A. type grid lock, their government is still COMMUNIST, and they enslave Tibet. I think I'll pass on this Olympics as I pass on Chinese manufactured goods.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

do as god like — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:40:28 GMT

Rob, Coatesville, PA---- "The CCP's position is that it's ok to criticize everybody else, but, you can't criticize the CCP (Central Communist Party).

All those black Audi cars you see are for Party members, not for the people. "

-----------did you do any servy?
did you have look at the chinese website, full of critical to the Gov. and CCP;
and where did you got that information about the car? otherwise, you just show your HATE!

do you agree GOD love chinese also?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Elmer — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:43:54 GMT

I don't blame the Chinese for yelling at the arrogant photographer for getting up on a table. That's disrespectful behavoir, he is a visitor in their country and can't just jump up on tables because he is in the press.

The Chinese rightly hate the press after the overblown coverage of the anti Olympic demonstrations in Paris, etc. They are sensitive about their country, which they love dearly. We are incredibly insensitive to their feelings and culture. The photographer on the table was no different from a loud mouth American tourist in Paris.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

whiteboyay, Atlanta, Ga — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:46:47 GMT

"NOT YOUR TYPICAL AMERICAN", I agree with you 100 percent. I am struck by how poorly written this article is and how ignorant it is to the facts. Your comparisons are spot on and I hope that the authors would learn some proper history before they throw around words like "perceived humiliation". We have a faulty past and present just as China does. Western Ethnocentrism and not Chinese pride from "perceived humiliation" is the only problem I see here.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

mia,qc, montreal — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:47:17 GMT

I don't understand why the air is still polluted in China and why the countries can't cheer for their team while showing the flags.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

DC, Philadelphia PA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:47:41 GMT

i like u.s. but i also like chinese food, keep up with the delish cuisine and i'll back ya.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Pat Huntington NY — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:47:55 GMT

Beijing 2008 = Munich, Nazi Germany 1936.

Plain and Simple. China is an autocratic, human rights violating, environmental destructing, pirating, war mongering, over populating communist dictatorship.

Beijing should NEVER have been allowed to host the Olympics. It stands for everything the Olympics does not.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Eric — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:49:06 GMT

China has terrible internet censorship, they hired more than 20 thousand IT policemen to block many websites, for example, Sina has 4 chinese websites (North American, Taiwan, Hong Kong, and Mainland China), in China you only can access to mainland-China website, they block all other three chinese-sina websites, because the other three dare to reports news fact, no matter bad news or good news both in political and economic news. Many Chinese are carzy guy like Nazi, they express explicitly want to bury American on Sina websites, they think China is the greatest than US and other western country. Although China government play low key in words, but their citizen are very crazy, I guess, these crazy guys are member of their propaganda force. US economic is in trouble low speed, but China has booming economic and make lot of money from western country ( foreign trade suplus reservse up to US$18,000 billion now). They do not appreciate western let them make money, instead they look down on westerner. It seem westerner are a foolish buyer of MadeInChina products.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Dean Chin, Hopatcong, NJ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:49:12 GMT

Native Americans,African-Americans, Asia-Americans and White-Americans are proud of being Americans. Is there anything wrong if the Chinese are proud of being Chinese?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

HD Kingston PA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:49:26 GMT

How many American soldiers gave their lives fighting Communism, and we’re expected to support the Olympics in a communist country? I for one will not watch one minute of it out of respect for our fallen soldiers.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

jake g, milwaukee wis — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:06:36 GMT

is anyone here really debating the fact the china treats its people better than america. How many americans move to china for a better life for their family? how many people flee from america to china for religous fredoms or even the huge economic growth?
The saddest part of americas relationship with china is that we didnt handle them correctly from the get go(communist revolution). we chose who we thought was the lesser of two evils and supported them (between russia or china). i dont think america is correct in most of its actions, but we should never compare america to one of the most oppresive goverments that is still functioning

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Hana, Saline, MI — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:07:10 GMT

If you want an example of pure nationalistic nonsense, examine the 1984 Summer Olympic games in Los Angeles. I suppose it's fine if Americans do it but heaven forbid anyone else exhibit a hint of nationalism.

Considering the sorry state of the economy, record home foreclosures, two political parties pandering to every group imaginable and an insane war in Iraq, leave it to the media to cover what is essentially a non-issue for most Americans.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Steve Huang, Athens, OH — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:08:04 GMT

First of all, being negative sells, especially to China now a day. That is surely one of reason that Western mainstream media is so bankrupt. This article is just so shallow and ignorant.

Patriotism is good thing for American but not for Chinese. Even high school football game here starts with the American Anthem. Sounds pretty nationalism in your term, is not it?

I am China born American citizen. I love China and American. One is my motherland and another is my motherland in law. To my observation, the Western view to China is a part of cold war legacy and part of superiority with anxiety. I has been critical of a lot things happening in China and here but in constructive way.

Yeah, Western has been leading human civilization during the past several hundred years. Along the way, a lot of lessons are drawn. a lot of brutality and human suffering as well. Now the rising of China and the East at large can learn from it. Chinese system is far from perfect and so do American. Otherwise how could this country select current president twice under the name of democracy? Is that ironic?

It is zero or whole game. The world is so twined together. The rule-Bad for China is good for American applies less and less.

The world leaps forward while our view toward it remained the same.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Tim, New York, NY — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:09:08 GMT

"trying imaging the British burning the White House and looting Washingon DC"--Not Your Typical American.

Does the War of 1812 ring a bell? In August of 1814 the British burned and looted Washington D.C. during the war of 1812. So I guess it is not too difficult to imagine.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Ben, Baltimore, MD — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:09:08 GMT

Deciding to have the Olympics in Beijing is like deciding to go to the beach in the rain. None of us can pretend we didn't see this kind of stuff coming the minute we all heard that Summer 2008 was going to be in China. Everyone's just going to come out of it with a lot of ugly feelings and bad blood.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

rob, ohio — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:09:32 GMT

I think we all forget that this is a communist country, does anyone remember the long hard faught cultural battles waged in the cold war. Now that we attach communist-capitalist china to the picture we are supposed to forget that they are communist. I despise communism more than anything and say shame on them for their percieved nationalism that is putting legs to this rediculous regime. I say drop the war on terror and begin the war on china... Now! Taiwan is our true alley and we should stockpile everything there and begin our assault. Chang Kai Shek is who we should have supported long ago to defeat Mao, now we must rethink what we did and what we must do now.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Thozmaniac, Genava, Ohio — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:09:45 GMT

Just like everyday, most posts are rationalized by slamming America....it's our fault China is like it is..."give me a friggin break"..
or, "it's GWB's fault"....c'mon people use the brain that's supposed to be in your head and stop believing that anything negative in the world is America's fault.

Stop trying to justify the vile human rights record of China by saying ludicrous crap like, "America is worse", or things just as idiotic.

I noticed on ANY post about ANY subject, the young clueless ands naive posters, as well as foreigners who have bought into the Anti-American rhetoric always blame America.
It could be about a friggin earthquake on venus and the posters will be blaming America and GWB..

It always ends up like that no matter what the subject of the post is and I'm getting quite burned out on this anti-American propaganda.

We'll probably be the only country taking part in the Olympics that boos it's own athletes. How sickening.

If the bad side of American etiquette is displayed at the Olympics I think we all know who'll be responsible. Yes, the far left crazy liberals who are bent on politicizing the games on the world stage.

These Olympics may be the last.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

fletc3her, Seattle, Washington — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:10:38 GMT

I'm surprised people still say things like "But we don't put people in prison for criticizing the gov't." This is just not true any more. American citizens currently have their phones tapped for no other reason than that they belong to a group which criticizes the government. The FBI is spying on war protesters, on muslims, on people who have been turned in to their hotline. And, American citizens have "disappeared" into the secret military prison system. It can take weeks or months to figure out that the government is holding them.

Political conventions now have "free speech zones" where protesters can exercise their God given rights. The "zone" looks like something out of a POW camp. A chain link square in the middle of a field, so far from the official proceedings that nobody will be inconvenienced by hearing what the protesters are saying. Protesting, exercising your free speech, outside of the "zone" leads to arrest.

The FBI uses unreasonable searches with little court oversight. The drug courts seize property with no due process. Prisoners are being denied their right to address the charges against them in court. They are being held for years without charge. And, prisoners are being tortured in custody.

Let's address the problems in America before we start attacking the Chinese too vehemently.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bob Wild-True — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:10:41 GMT

If you read all the comments--- all the Chinese writers (holding US citizenship or Chinese citizenship) actually supported the article---- they are too proud to take any criticism, even it's true and fight back with 100 times more anger!
In US or Canada, we don't attack people if someone says bad about our country....until they do attack us.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jerry, Taiwan, Republic of Taiwan — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:41:03 GMT

What is sad for Chinese is that they believe as a result of government-controlled propaganda that Olympic games is more important than human rights, exploitation of cheap labor, environment issues, political freedom. All these issues are suppressed by the collectivistic and single-minded views that Olympic games are far more important than other things else.

As a Taiwanese (more than 2000 missiles now targeting Taiwan to destroy its democracy), Western countries are so apathetic to Chinese human right issues and they care more about economic benefits.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Billy, Beijing — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:41:42 GMT

I live in Beijing. People waited 2 days on line for tickets and you walk in to stand on top of a table to film them as they're tired and smelly and not sure if there are enough tickets? You got what you deserved. Let me guess, you strode in like you had a right to be there and none of your crew speaks mandarin or knows the culture, meaning none of you has local Beijing friends, preferring to keep a tight circle of expat acquaintances. Good luck on your Olympic 'insights'.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

bartismo G.P Oregon — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:42:32 GMT

To the person with the user name Shamefully American. Please dont let the door hit You on the ass on the way out of this great country. Also to Mike H from the windy city. You need to get out to You are a raceist.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jay Lee, Galveston, Texas — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:45:32 GMT

Americans are spending billions of dollars on war and Chinese are spending billions of dollars on Olympics. Why we are the good ones and they are the bad ones? Is the national pride a bad thing?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

G D, Denver, CO — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:45:35 GMT

China is just beginning to grow as a counry. We tend to forget that the United States has not always been at the fore front of human rights either. We are not that separated from times when the working class of the United States were working 16 hour days in sweat shops for less than a dollar a day. It has been less that 100 years that our women have had the right to vote, and less than 50 since the lychings were stopped in the south. Before the first Europeans landed in North America there were about 12 million Native Americans, and they now number less than 300,000, as they were almost completely wiped out. Before we cast the first stone at the Chinese government, we need to remember the atrocities, and lack of human rights, committed by our own.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Michael Brown — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:45:47 GMT

This is about the Chinese political system. Does the government of China allow their people to publically express anything other than pride in their nation? If a Chinese citizen said the pollution was an embarassment on a world wide broadcast what would happen to her? Would she be arrested? My objection to China is that the average Chinese has absolutely no recourse if he objects to conditions in his country.
That alone would keep me from watching China's Olympics.
It helps that the Olympics have little relevance as they become increasingly professionalized and commercialized. I loved watching the competition at the time professional athletes were forbidden. Yes, countries like the Soviet Union wormed their way around that rule, but that fact made it that much more sweet when a true amateur won. Think Lake Placid 1980. The "Dream Team"? What a joke.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Alex, Austin, TX — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:47:38 GMT

The and 1936 Olympics were held in Berlin and not Munich(1972). China should never have been awarded the Olympics. Money and power talk very loudly though. They are there and we have to deal with that. Hopefully all will go smoothly

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Lauren, New York, NY — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:48:26 GMT

For those who criticize China... how many have actually been to China to go beyond perpetuating outdated perception. China is a major economy rising - it is still however learning how to deal with its new status and presence on the world stage. I have every confidence it will get there - the Olympics is one step in that direction.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

JBG, Evansville, In — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:49:54 GMT

I have traveled to many foriegn countries and you have to respect them for who they are in order to have them respect you for who you are. Every nation has its own laws. What we believe in may not be the same in their country. That is what you have to respect. And about air quality?!!! Here in the States we have our own ozone alerts!!! Just deal with it. With the rise of terrorism its no wonder they are a little on edge. I would too.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike Blumberg — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 16:50:10 GMT

Many American & some other westerners have to learn to respect the Chinese culture and other cultures. The Chinese have a very long,proud history and culture well over 5,000 year. America has only been around 200 plus years and western culture much less than the Chinese.
In fact, China will be the leading economy before too long and they are already our Bankers- funding our deficit and our way of life
It seems to me that its terrible rude and disrespectful to travel to someone else country and stand on a table in such sensitive surrounding and take pictures. That was the ultimate act of stupidity and arrogance. I'm an American who has deep familiarity with both cultures and a student of world history. The Chinese still view many westerners as 'Barbarians' and view their culture as inferiror and are very sensitive and suspicious to any perceive slights by any westerner. My advice to all Americans learn Chinese mandarin as soon as you can - it could be your ticket in getting a good job in the future

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

scorr, las vegas, nevada — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:25:18 GMT

Why is anybody suprised by communist censorship? You all act like this is a new thing. If the World, the USA included, we would not be attending these games in a communist, repressive country. Instead we are buddying up to socialism and communism for the sake of "world unity". These should be called the Red Smog Olympics.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Grove, Mesa, AZ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:25:23 GMT

Seems to me that the flying tigers went into China and help keep the Jap,s from over running their country. Several died and are still there. What do you mean "Western humiliation". We faught in Korea and they took us to a draw. We fought them in Vietnam and they kicked our butts out. They forget why they had a Tetimen square or that their own people where killed in a fight for freedom. How convenent, but then their just like every one else. "Lets blame the Americans" As to the rest of you, if you would please move to China you'll be much happier. Oh, thats right, They all ready own us.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Meg, NJ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:26:04 GMT

Can everyone remember the athletes. Some of them have been working all there lives to go to the Olympics. Lets think of them also.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Chris, Shanghai China — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:28:21 GMT

FYI, I'm reading this, right now, from China. Yes there is national pride - but as a proud American myself, I think that frankly, they are entitled to some self-served kudos. The way forward is for the US and China to work together; just being threatened by China is not going to accomplish much

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Doug Mays West Chester, OH — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:29:27 GMT

I heard today's news about the IOC agreeing to allow the Chinese government to censor the internet for visiting journalists and it disgusts me. This it shocking! I smell the stench of corruption. The IOC is out of control and some entity should launch an investigation. I know this will not sit well with many people but given the huge problem of corruption in the Chinese government I suspect some bribes made their way into certain IOC's official’s pockets. The same survey mention in the article also cited official corruption to be the number one concern of the Chinese people.
I would not watch a single event if it were not for my wife being from China. Instead I will make it a point to not to purchase any advertiser’s products. If enough people would do likewise it would eventually work its way back to biting the IOC.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

ken bell ,pulaski, va, — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:30:05 GMT

The U.S. plans to send 1800 athlethes , coaches and trainers to china to proudly wear the Red, White and Blue. 1800 uniforms, jackets bags, hats etc.....and di you know that a chinese apparell company was awarded the contract to design and produce these items?..makes we wonder why we should even get excited about seeing our flag raised when we win a medal, old glory will surely have a "made in china" tag sewed on it somewhere.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Kevin McDonald — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:32:07 GMT

A totalitarian state run by the communist party. It never should have even been allowed to bid for the games. Send your film crews to the graves and prisons of those murdered and imprisoned by thugs. Don't give us the sob story about old colonial injustices. That does not justify oppression today. They are brainwashed by the police state or afraid to speak the truth.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Randy — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:32:08 GMT

I am disgusted by the level of ignorance being displayed here. Posters are talking about how they are "amazed" that the vast majority of Chinese people support their government.

The reason you find that hard to believe is because you don't have any understanding of how BAD things were before. The article mentioned "perceived humiliations".....what a crock. China's humiliation during the past 200 years is very very real. China had to put up with European and American powers walking around China like they owned the place. Then the Japanese invaded, and then you had the Cultural Revolution which was basically a backlash against all of the foreign invasions. So yeah, when you have a midddle class that can afford to buy cars and have good jobs and people aren't starving to death, -that is PROGRESS to them.

China's government is responsible for 1/4th of all humanity. They have to feed them, clothe them, house them, and find jobs for all of them. That is a huge undertaking. Sure, the human rights situation sucks, but really, who cares about human rights when you're struggling to feed yourself? You have to start SOMEWHERE.

If Americans were starving to death and had no jobs or shelter they wouldn't give a crap about "freedom of the press" either. You have to survive first before you can worry about those other things.

Americans have absolutely no conception of how POOR China is and how far they have come.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Chris, Virginia — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:32:57 GMT

We Americans are so stupid, the rest of the world hates us yet we continue to support it and China most of all, they buy up the dollar to keep it weak and strenthen their own and then when their are signs of life they flood the market with the US dollar to make it worthless... Yet we still continue to buy junk from China. I guess we liek lead and want our kids to die from eating a drug laced toy!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bernardo Chua, West Orange, NJ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:33:29 GMT

Olympics is a sports festivals that comes only once in 4 years. To tie this event with human rights, Darfur, death sentence, and others is simply ridiculous. Some just lament that Amnesty and Falungong websites are blocked from the internet. What's wrong with that? Why would athletes want to do with these 2 websites if they are not already skewed.
Some even criticized that China designated 3 areas for demonstrations. What's wrong with that? In the US, you will also be assigned to an area to demonstrate after you have your permit approved. No one can demonstrate at anytime he wants. Newsweek reports China wants to get more medals than America. You know what, China just want to show that Chinese can also get ahead in sports. Let's just let China be. Don't just criticize just to put them down. Enjoy the Game as it unfold you and watch it with an objective mentality just to have fun and not to poke fun or look for mistakes or even wishing it to fail.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Trevor, Columbus OH — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:34:00 GMT

ok I think somebody needs to really inform people of what is going on in China. Us Americans think that because they do not do everything and have every freedom that us Americans have that they are wrong for it. But the thing everybody should be focusing on is look at how far China has come. 30 years ago they had nothing, everybody was a farmer and everybody was poor. Now is their industrial revolution, think of where we were as a country during ours. We say slave labor, look at the facts it may be slave labor by American standards but to the Chinese working that job they were already pulling 12 hour shifts now they pull 12 hour shifts and make at least twice as much, what you think they should go from poor by American standrds to $40,000 a year just because that is the standard in America? At one time there were only two classes in China the very rich and the very poor, now there is a middle class and it is growing fast. China has pulled 300 million people out of poverty in the last 10 years, thats the size of America if you want to compare size, how many has our goverment pulled out? I bet the number is negative. You say bad government, but that government is the only thing holding this monster together right now without the "communist" government they would spiral out of control. So blame the goverment because without it life in China would be much worse.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Lorraine Taube Brockway Township, Michigan — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:38:52 GMT

Great!! But just remember, China's run by a Communist government. Communists don't know or understand the word or concept of freedom. " Act patriatic or else". Who knows if the feelings are really there. Oh I'm sure there must be feeling of pride but just don't read too much into the patriatic actions. I have always thought that I would like to see China until the reds took over but now I am so anti-communist that I kid that they would arrest me before I got off the plane. The same about Cuba. I understand that Cuba is a very beautiful country but--- I won't even watch the games--wouldn't anyway since I'm not really interested in sports of any kind so who cares. I will say GOOD LUCK to our athlets.ldt1930

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Edd Hart — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:38:57 GMT

The Chinese Olympic Games in China are nothing but a joke considering their Human Right’s violations now and in the past. China is no better than Hitler in hosting the 1939 games – have we not learned from the past or are we destined to ever forget the past?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bobby Liu, Yardville, NJ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:39:02 GMT

We had those prides so we don't think it big deal but China does not think so since they have lost almost all the prides to the western countries and Japan. If we American see some country posting a sign that reads 'No dogs and American allowed' at park entrance and the park is on American land, how would we react? Today's Shanghai is booming but back to less than 100 years ago, the well kept Shanghai park Englishmen got from China through its infamous opium war did just that. Great Britain through its Eastern India Trading Arm forced China and its people to buy opium from them, some Chinese refused and GB blamed China for not allowing Free Trading and claimed war on China and won the war. As result, GB got more territorial concessions and free trade ports including Shanghai and Hong Kong.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

David, Los Angeles — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:40:23 GMT

"I still won't watch the games. Between Tibet, Tiawan, and the sale of organs through exucution of political prisoners China makes the rest of the world look good. Then toss in the lack of repsonse in the Sudan to the genocide which China's government profits from oil revenues from that country.

But hey, i am just a blood thirsty American, right? "

You are more likely considered a 'gwilo' (foreign white devil) perhaps . . .

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Robert Jackson MS — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:40:25 GMT

Ok all these comments about Tibet and Tiawan are just silly. "IF" Tibet was a nation in and of itself..America would have to give it aid. More tax dollars for no reason..."IF" Taiwan was a nation in and of itself...America would have to give it aid. More tax dollars for no reason. Is everyone starting to get the picture?? Why put more debt in our pockets. Let it be...And seriously people...do you honestly think that Tibet could run itself? What kind of GDP do they actually have? Farming? Tourism? How many people can actually climb the Himalayas?

Please just enjoy the Olympics for what it is, a time when nations get together and compete in sports instead of wars.

Think about it this way...President Bush is going. Its gotta be cool!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jim Schmidt, Rio Rancho, New Mexico — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:40:31 GMT

I'm definitely amazed at the amount of Westerners who know absolutely nothing.

But then again, you are American, I suppose it is excuseable.
Shamefully American (Sent Wednesday, July 30, 2008 10:21 AM)

I'm sure that you are brillant and one of the enlightened among us. I'm so sorry that you feel the need to torture yourself by remaining an American. Please, for your sake, consider citizenship in another nation of your choosing. I'm sure you'll be happier.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bernardo Chua, West Orange, NJ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:43:20 GMT

For Joe Owen. If someone would take out a tiny tibetan flag, I would not doubt that security will have him arrested for creating public disturbance. Remember, you are in China and therefore you are expected to respect Chinese laws. As they say, when in Rome, do as the Romans.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

BeijingBushman, CGA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:43:39 GMT

wow May Lee and oea. Ya'lls really ignorant aint'cha

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Manon, (born in Indonesia, raised in Greece, living in Chicago, USA) — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:43:54 GMT

Wow! I am shoked with the ignorance, lack of understanding, and hatred not only against the Chinese people but between those making the above comments. I would not argue that there seems to be a gap between the image China is promoting of herself and the realities with regards to the issue of human rights. However, the issues the article brings up for discussion are more that we think and require a broader understanding of the world (ie, cultural differences), an open mind, and a willingness to see the wrong and right on both sides. Unfortunately, vary few of the above comments reflect these basic elements which a vital to the finding the solution to any problem. Above all, both Americans and Chinese are in need of vital relationship with God. If we make peace with God through Jesus Christ, we can then live in peace with each other.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jay, Chapel Hill, NC — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:46:52 GMT

Just looking at the picture of the little girl in this article, she was holding Olympic flags, even not Chinese flags. How can you say "Future nationalist youth" (good question). On July 4th, we can see our girls wave American flags all over the country, will Chinese call our kids "Future nationalist youth of American"? I bet they should.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

B. Murphy Fort Lauderdale, Florida — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:48:40 GMT

One comment suggests that there is nothing wrong witn nationial pride. That was the case in the 1930s in Germany, so many more thought is called for.

I have been to China twice for exended periods in the last 8 months, and have watched it closely for some time. Its a county run by a bunch of thugs who will lie about anything, and who murder their own citizens. They also support the worst of the world's rulers, and threaten their neighbors who they can bully.

lOTS OR REASON FOR PRIDE, RIGHT. WAKE UP

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Shawn, Houston — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:49:43 GMT

Having lived in the States for near 20 years, I find it is very disappointed that average American still knows very little about China and ordinary Chinese.

To compare the current Chinese government with Nazi, Neal, you will be considered in China to have been living on Mars for the last 20 years.

My family had been politically prosecuted by the communist during Mao's years (30 years ago). I never liked the communist. However, I have to agree that the current government dose win the hearts of tens of millions of Chinese. The current Chinese government is actually an authoritarian system with capitalism economy.

To compare China horizontally with other countries, say U.S., yes, China still has a long way to catch-up. But, if you also compare China vertically (historically), in the last 20 years China has made great accomplishment economically, and has made less but still significant improvement politically.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

StarStuff...Western CO — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:50:02 GMT

I will not be watching China's "Coming Out Party". The Olympics have become nothing more than a way for political ideologies, religious zealots and a myriad of other groups, to stage some kind of show! The Chinese will probably never get over their "humiliation" and they will be a huge military nightmare in the near future. I for one, do not, and will not trust them as long as I live! The parties face is on both sides of the coin!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Kevin Davies NYC — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:51:41 GMT

Wow. China is really not much different than America after all.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Rick Buch — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:52:47 GMT

I think we need to understand that the chinese people are just starting to westernize just as japan did with our help after ww2. China is a major economic world power now and we better accept this. Yes we influenced this by moving our industry to their country. Now thanks to a multi-trillion dollar war we have engaged in, China nearly owns our country's national debt. So yes they have a right to be proud of their country and we should be ashamed of what WE (yes, you and me) have allowed to happen to our country. It is way too late to reverse the damage done to our country. We needed to protect our industries from cheap imports 40 years ago(tariffs) but didn't. Now we will pay the price. I just hope we can survive near depression era conditions.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Heather, Oregon — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:54:08 GMT

Wow. Who knew that there was all this judgement, racism and condemnation in America. Mabey it is because I am to young to know all the history or mabey it's because my whole generation has been raised being told that it is not okay to talk the way the people in this blog have been talking about another nationality. When is it that we as people will be happy for someone who is happy and will cry with those who are sad. Is it because we are unhappy ourselves, we can't imagine being so behind our countries actions. It take absolute attrocity to rally the American people, and even then we are only interested for a week or two and then we're moving right along. These are people who don't(apparently). So let's not do the "ugly American thing" let's have respect for someone else who does things and thinks about things differently than us. Let's behave like guests in another man's country. Let's put someone else's shoes on for a day.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mark, Albuquerque, NM — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:57:06 GMT

To 'Not Your Typical American". If you are going to cite history as to the reasons for "perceived Chinese humiliation" at least get your history straight. It was the Boxer Rebellion not the Boxing rebellion and please read at least a little bit about that historical event before you start spouting off on the usual Western oppression of the East hysterics.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Joe, Denver, co — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:00:35 GMT

Adrienne Mong, you should say American is Nationalism too. Americans dose same thing. Adrienne Mong you are not good at all.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

F.Latus, NJ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:03:41 GMT

What a bunch of hateful, ignorant people in this world. Is no one able to debate anything, without becoming hostile, insulting?....

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bill Murphy — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:05:55 GMT

having now read many of the comments make here, it shows just how far off base some are. The issue in not the Chinese people, at least not for the most part, it is their terrible government. A bad as China is to its neighbors(Tibet in particular)the biggest offense is to its own people. For those who make excuses for the communist party, just think about all those who still rot in Chinese jails for making any comments againt the govenment. These bums are the people some of you are defending.
Also, do you know that this govenment is putting spyware in place at all hotel in beijing to spy on visitors to the games, and the U.S. State Department has warned visitors to expect their rooms to be searched. NOW AINT THESE FOLKS JUST WONDERFUL PATRIOTS!
And oh, i just happen to have a Chinese girlfriend from mainland China, so I have no dislike for Chinese peopls

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

ZL Lin, Subang Jaya, Malaysia — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:06:30 GMT

China and United States were the best of Friends when we had a common enemy.
Eg against the Europesn Imperialists in the early 1900s, against Japan in WW2 and against the former USSR.

Why is it that China and United States cannot get along when we do not have an enemy ?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Lori Eastman San Diego, CA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:28:28 GMT

China is going to show the whole world what a great Olympics looks like, they have already letf us (the United States) in the dust economically, as has India, oh how far we have fallen, lies to invade Iraq, weak economy etc..

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

feei, seattle, wa — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:28:43 GMT

when a country goes through the process of eradicating the traditional morals from an entire generation of young it sets a dire course for future generations. look at germany (WWI and WWII) and japan (WWII). every country and those that reside in it have their baises. it just depends on how far their willing to take it.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

sljdf;lsjflksdf — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:29:50 GMT

chinas' nationalism is no different then any other nation. The west is not to blame for their ills, they are to blame. Ridiculous all these nations shifting blame from their own societal responsibilities to deal with the way their elitist members form govt. and how it deals with the the elitist of other nations. No body put a gun to their head and told them to be communist accept other chinese. The olympics suck anyway, who's kids have the chance to compete, elitist as always. Even 3rd worlds have elitist, people who occupy space but preform no extraordinary tasks for the furtherment of the community and still expect based on lineage to be given the cream off the top, to be the cream of the crop.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Concerned Citizen, My house — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:32:47 GMT

It's funny really. Everyone here discussing about pride and making racist comments and talking about nuking each other. And Mike, the chinese aren't evil. They're people endured hardships and maybe don't take too kindly to foreigners putting them down. Chinese are only aggressive because they have to be. I am an american, but that doesnt make a bloodthirsty hypcrit. Everyone in the world looks at the U.S. as world power. As long as people are smart and play it safe, U.S. and china may have a fruitful and a mutual relationship.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Alex, Boulder — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:33:47 GMT

One thing everyone here needs to understand: Eastern and Western Cultures are FUNDAMENTALLY different. The Chinese and members of many other Asian cultures are much more collectivistic than Americans are. This means that yes, they tend to put the well-being of the state (and the state's image, for that matter) well above personal issues. While I am not a fan of China's government or the way Corporate America's drive for profits has undermined our own economy, I understand that simply because China does not work like America does not entail that its people are unhappy about it.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jamie, Los Angeles, CA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:36:27 GMT

For the life of me - I can't understand why there are so many "China" bashers - especially for those of you who have never been there. China has spent a good amount of the last century being "bullied" by the rest of the world. It only makes sense that their government will institute policies that protect their interests since it is obvious that nobody else will!

Then there's all this talk about Free Speech in America? What does Free Speech mean to Americans anyways? I am American and I am proud to be American, but I am not naiive enough to think that America is the perfect world model and that every country should be run like America.

At least in China, there is no false pretense about the government's intentions. They intend to exert control and they let that be known. If you don't think that's the case here in America, you should probably pull your head out of your rear end and pick up a foreign newspaper or something.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Proud American — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:55:31 GMT

awful lot of liberal American communists posting here...McCarthy tried to warn us about you...if you are "shamefully American', it is because you are a marxist and should probably move to China...if you marry a Chinese woman and you feel like a guest in her home country,then you should not be offended if we treat your wife like a guest here in America...ooooh....your liberal double standard flip-flopping stands in the way....too bad

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike, Spokane, Wash — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:11:32 GMT

China is still Orwellian 1984. The government pushes a group think mentality. Americans still value the individual. I do agree that from a manipulation perspective, that no-one has used it to this degree since 1936. If anyone doesn't think that we are getting China’s propaganda Nationalism poured into us, they are naive if not ignorant. And to "Mike H," your responses are stupid.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

John Doe, Seattle, Wash. — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:12:13 GMT

I believe in the value of truth above all else. A reasonable adult should at least be allowed to know the truth, and by extension, be allowed to know all competing view points. In America, this is allowed. America has many problems of which I will criticize. In China, knowledge is actively suppressed by the government.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Brad Tarr, Newark, CA — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:15:37 GMT

I have to laugh at the negative insinuation of nationalism endemic in this article. Athletes at all kinds of international competitions (other than golf and tennis)routinely wave their countries' flag, and have been doing so for decades--in fact, if you don't, it stands out. The fans introduced it, and expect it to be demonstrated in the arena. The commentators (no doubt goaded by the network owners) get into the act as well. Why be surprised that it spills over into the street--especially in an autocratic state like China?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Lee — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:25:25 GMT

I will watch the Olympics, To support our athletes, our flag, and the athletes, from around the world.
A time for the nations to be at PEACE. To notice we are all human beings and to find comfort in one another. God Bless the people everywhere in every country. I am a Patriotic American, and, Friend to everyone in every nation. Bless you in whatever religion! Not All Americans are Hateful. (((((((Free Hugs))))))) to all.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

David, Austin, TX — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:25:58 GMT

Mary Lee says: In the last two decades, China has lifted 1.3 billion people (over 20% of population on earth) out of poverty.

WOW that is amazing... nobody in China is in poverty. Truly astounding. Did you hear that from the Chinese government? Well according to the World Bank 46.7% of China lives under $2 a day. I think I will believe the world bank.

Oh and standing on a table might be rude but how exactly does it disrespect the Olympic spirit and besmirch China?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jim, Changchun — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:33:02 GMT

I am writing from Changchun. There is no difficulty getting this article on MSN.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Alex, Los Angeles — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:33:45 GMT

Before any Americans rag on China, I think an unbiased visit is needed first. China is not as backward a country as the west might see it. Things are different there, yes. The U.S. is advanced in many ways compared to China. But there are also many ways in which China is advanced compared to the U.S. Learn to appreciate difference and let's not resort to any anti-US/anti-China rebuttals.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Alex, Los Angeles — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:37:30 GMT

I see a lot of people here with a low tolerance for ambiguity. These people perpetuate the "west is best" and "ugly american" stereotypes. You people should just stay in the US where youll be happy. Unworldly as you may be, it'd probably be best for the rest of the world if you didn't venture to far out of your bubbles.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Herb, Tampa, FL — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:38:58 GMT

To Rob in Coatesville, Pennsylvania:
If you think the Chinese people are so bad, why have you gone there many times? Was there something there that you liked?

I,too, am married to a wonderful Chinese lady. Her family in China is my family, my family here in the U.S. is her family. And though I love the U.S., I feel love for China and think of it as my adopted country.

While we see the economy (and morals) going down in the U.S., the standard of living and unity in China is going up. People who want to spend their time bashing China should take a look at what's happening here in the U.S.
Gay marriage, for example. A sham in the face of our country. An out-of-whack Immigration program, etc., etc.
Human Rights? I don't know about you, but I think it smacks our own Human Rights record in the face when our President gives more importance to Iraq (when they had nothing to do with 911) than he does rebuilding New Orleans and other areas hit hard by Katrina. If you don't believe this, just ask the people who live there.
Wake up, Folks.
I'm glad the Chinese are hosting the 2008 Olympics. Good for them!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Ryan, Phoenix, AZ — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:41:23 GMT

"All comments must be approved before appearing in the thread; time and space constraints prevent all comments from appearing. We will only approve comments that are directly related to the blog, use appropriate language and are not attacking the comments of others."
Censorship exists in the united states too!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Alex, Los Angeles — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:41:33 GMT

If only Americans had the sense of nationalism and pride in their own country as the Chinese do.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Renee — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 00:39:53 GMT

I worked today so am jumping in late here. Aside from all the politics, perceived and real racism, prejudism, world (China and America) views of varying degrees, the games are to be enjoyed by the people who have worked all thier lives to get there and the people who want to enjoy participating in their own way. OF COURSE, the bottom line is about the money to the sponsors, advertisers and other people who will profit. Is that not why we all go to work inthe morning? To provide money for ourselves. Anyway, despite all the important things the games mean to each of us human beings, the reporter and the cameraman should not have gone onthe table. Please, who do you think you are? I would not like you to come to my home and get on my table. Eventhough you may think you "have special priveledges" It is no reason to be uncouth. Be creative, figure out another way to get your job done. Please. Maybe you take yourself to seriously or make yourself more important than common courtesies. What were you thinking? You will have more opportunities, maybe even something better will come along. Usually, things work better when we all play by the same rules.
Have you never heard the saying from a kid's tv program: "Good manners show people you care about them"

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

john,auckland, nz — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 00:59:37 GMT

well, the author's workmate definitely should've jumped on that table, it was very rude and ill-mannered, and when you do thinga wrong, you get reprimanded, so what are you making a big fuss about? shouldn't people love and be proud of their country?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

LR, Brooklyn, NY — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 01:18:54 GMT

By allowing the Chinese to host the Olympics our country and our politicians patronize the attrocities China committs against the human race.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Steve,,, San Diego — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 01:19:23 GMT

Every country has growing pains and national pride. Remember not so long ago,Martin Luther King said "Thank God Almighty, I'm free at last". China has a long and proud history and is just now breaking into the modern world as we know it. Being free at last is likely less important to the Chinese than keeping a good face to the outside world. Foreigners that visit China or any other country should try to understand the customs and behavior of that country and hopefully carry something good back from it. I don't think there is any one person or country that has all the answers but I do think the athelets deserve the attention--not the politics. I always focus on the human contest.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

A Chines,Eugene,Oregon — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 01:56:11 GMT

What the us Chinese do is nothing compared to the what the West(And Japan) did to China.

Just to name a few

Great Britain:Opium Wars,attempting to smuggle opium through China.We did the right thing by keeping the Brittish from smuggling.Then they decided to attack us.
Japan:Begin the Sino-Japanese war.

Dealing with infamous countries is nothing compared to this.So stop disrupting the games!If America was hosting,wouldn't people be criticizing it too.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Cletus Dallas Oregon — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:00:24 GMT

China has the economy, miltary might and enough "Pride" to do as they please...try living your life for one week without using something made and/or asembled in china, and your see what I mean.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

RMJakubowicz, NYC — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:25:38 GMT

To all you Anti - Chinese. You probably have not been to China, and have no idea what the people or government is really like. After visting the country 4 times in 2 years, I have nothing but good things to say about the Chinese and the Chinese government. For those that want to talk about political and governmental evils, take a good hard long look at out government.
I only hope the games work out well for the chinese.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Brian, Vancouver, BC, CANADA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:36:51 GMT

It is really amazing that China's Citizenship is so totally insecure that they and their government believe that they have to be the world's biggest bully. They just have to rethink their incredible history and contributions to the world's society over their 5000 year history to realize how great they truly are and stop all of this crazy propaganda, control, abuse, and fraudulant acts.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

lynn,sd — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:51:58 GMT

Damn the doomed western media that has distorted China during their naive coverage.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

We Ignorant Americans — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:08:40 GMT

Humn, lets see, we American tourists are hated in other countries because we think we are the only nation that matters so we could care less what others think of us when we visit other cultures. When I was in Europe, I could pick out which ones are Americans by their T-shirts, shorts, & tennis shoes.

Then this news cameraman decides that he has the right to stand on a table to get his news and doesn't even know that he's disrespecting the Chinese culture. It's indeed a clueless American like the rest of us. Can you imagine a foreign tourist shooting a finger when he's here in the states? Would we not get angry over it?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Dan Wu, Boston, MA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:17:29 GMT

I'm not mad at the Chinese. It's American business that is helping to make China strong and as a result supports their nationalism and makes it stronger.

We outsource anything and everything that we can to them and they just get stronger as we get weaker with fewer jobs.

They are the smart ones and their country will probably become the strongest in all areas. It's only been a short time that we've been a world power and it won't last the way we are going.

Why don't we outsource our government to them too?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

dean corso, san francisco, ca — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:27:29 GMT

Rob, Coatesville, PA

you are so miserable there, but why do you keep returning to china again and again?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Mike L, New Jersey — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:31:41 GMT

Is this comment section closed? It seems "convenient" that MSNBC has removed this news from their front page. Hell, I can't even find when doing a search on the website! Three of my comments have not been posted either. At least one of them was a thoughful, meaningful comment. So, why are you censoring?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bob Nugent ---- Riverside California — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:41:47 GMT

I have spent time traveling in China . I find the people to be friendly happy and fun to be with .They are always willing to help . The China culture tells us it is not right to stand on tables . Every country has problems . China is no different than any other country . I found my stays in China to be A positive experence .

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Reinhold — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:43:58 GMT

By the way, the 1936 games was in Berlin and not in Munish.
Munish wat in 1972.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Chris , KS — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 04:18:11 GMT

The fact is the Beijing Olympics is going to be censored and sanitized by the P.R.C. The Chinese government should abide by the agreement to show the Olympics openly. The extreme pollution issue should have prevented the P.R.C from even being considered as a host. China having a terrible history is no excuse for reeducation camps, Taiwanese bullying, and lack of fundamental human rights. By all means be proud of your country but have good reasons for being that way.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

American in China — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 04:23:27 GMT

I'm an American, just read this article and the postings while sitting in Beijing. This place has a long way to go, but for the average Chinese they have more personal and economic freedoms than probably at any point in their 5000 year history. We can hope for the Games to fail and continue the insecurity and all the baggage that goes with it, or we can hope that a successful outcome will help them move down a different path. If you think a proud, strong China is scary, watch what you ask for, the alternative would probably be so much worse--think Yugoslavia on steroids.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Li, Beijing — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:04:23 GMT

I do not agree at some certain information reflected in above message. I am also one migrant worker in Beijing, furthermore, about 80% of my colleagues are from other cities, none of us has been repatriated home just because of the Games. Seems lots of foreign journalists do not REALLY understand our Chinese and China. Most of them just run into conclusion by seeing or hearing a piece of clip of some information/incidents.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Giin — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:06:09 GMT

If you are so loud about the human right, folks! Bring the soldiers back and stop the weapons around the world, especially in the middle east. The lost souls deserve HUMAN RIGHT deprived by the western weapons! Don't even try to think about it and forget it? What an easy way to get away with it. I guess that most of the journalists lost their directions, or being steered away by their keen governments. If you can spend so much energy buzzing the Chinese so much for them trying to contribute to the Olympic Game, you might as well buzz your governments for something good and don't stop until the end!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

JJ, Xi'an, Shaanxi — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:08:39 GMT

Hello y'all on the wall, I have been reading with great interest the various comments and thoughts regarding what China is or is not and the pleas to separate the Olympics from the Politics. It is astounding to read so many people's misconceptions of what China is today. BTW, internet is not blocked here in the middle of China (Xi'an) so please remove that myth from your thoughts and even in Beijing any real or perceived restrictions are easily bypassed using 3rd party routers or your mobile phone to access internet (GPRS). I've only been here 3+ years so I do not understand China yet, but it is definately not what is listed so far. Let's enjoy the games and let these 1.3 Billion people figure out what system they feel meets their needs, and if it is not our US system so be it.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Marshall,Nanking,China — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:10:31 GMT

As a Chinese,I just want to say:"Welcome to beijing,welcome to china."

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

nanjing, china — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:27:16 GMT

To Neal:
I write this sentence in Nanjing, China Mainland.
Things are not so bad as you think.
Welcome to China, and feel China by yourself!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jessica Shao Jilin China — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:39:14 GMT

Don't make a mountain out of a mole hill.it seems so ridiculously childish

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Peter, CO — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:49:36 GMT

I loived in China for three years and met many, wonderful kind people...they all loved their country, but also wanted to know how to emigrate to Canada, or anywhere that would allow them the chance for advancement. Also, they conducted this process in as much secrecy as possible because they were afraid what would happen if their employers found out they wanted to leave.

As for raising 1.6 billion out of poverty...I think not...the people in the countryside continue to struggle and many resent the economic success that is focussed in the major cities.

As with many things, the issues in China are not simple and it is dangerous to over-simplify them...or to sink into either pro or anti-Chinese rhetoric.

The reality is that China is here to stay and the rest of the world, the U.S. included is going to need to figure out what that means for the political, economic and environmental future of the world.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Michelle, AZ — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 06:55:37 GMT

MGO, your right. Americans can be patriotic but all other countries are simply showing their nationalism. That's quite a shame considering the day and age we are in.
LEt China hold the games. They have every right too. I do not think they prepared adequetly for them though. This will hurt all athletes performances. Hhopefully, we can still have an amazing Olympic year. The Olympics are meant to bring people together, not to tear them apart. China may not be perfect, but let the games go on and enjoy them just as you would any other year.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

maky, Philippines — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 06:58:27 GMT

I would understand why the chinese react the way they do to western media criticism. There is a lot of ignorant, one sided reporting out there. Special mention: BBC. As mentioned by "Not Your Typical American", a little study of history will work wonders for your perception. The chinese have never been an aggressive race. They have traded for centuries with neighboring countries (they were in contact with south east asian nations before the west) but never invaded them... unlike western colonial powers. They mind their own business... unlike the west. Yes their government is imperfect... but give them time, democracy is earned not given to people. I have seen the effect of democracy given to the people in my country, it isn't pretty. We need a benevolent despot before we can truly become a democratic nation. Wish we have leaders like they do in china who work for the betterment of the nation even if they enrich themselves in the process (like US leaders). In our country politicians enrich themselves at the expense of the country.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

xu — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 07:03:35 GMT

to Geal
" Of course, no one in China will ever see this reporting because it will be consored via the great firewall. "----i'm in china and i see this reporting and it is not censored via the great firewall,so you're lying intentionally or due to arrogance. you don't have a clue about the situation and you make a malicious analogy, we call this arrogance. don't make comments before you can spell correctly, it's "censor" not "consor".

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

L, Beijing, China — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 08:38:12 GMT

As someone living in Beijing right now, I agree that the games are not terribly fun. There have been a lot of new restrictions placed on both foreigners and locals alike. While proud that China is getting its chance to showcase the Games, many are grumbling as to the toll it is taking on the country and the economy.
However, though the Games have sparked a lot of debates, insinutating intense nationalism due to a foreigner's blatent disregard of manners and customs, whether Chinese or international, is wrong.

Americans are as proud as any of our country. We've held the Games numerous times, as well as compete solidly every year. As Chicago is currently bidding for the 2016 Games, and as New York lost the 2012 bid, it is important for Americans to realize that we would be as proud as any nation to hold them, albeit we would hold them in different ways.

Both the Olympic Games and China are not new to controversy. Munich and Sarajevo are good examples of that. However, just because one Chinese yelled at a foreign journalist does not mean there is a huge wave of Chinese nationalism surging through the country. It could, in fact, just have been an irate person asking them to get off the table.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Pee Jay Escaped from China — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 08:49:10 GMT

May Lee Dear, you poor girl, 86% of the population, c'mon wake up, 86% of the chinese population dont even have education and are illiterate.

1.3b people have not been lifted out of poverty, nearly 1b chinese live on less than 2 USD a week.

These are Chinese government figures, confirmed by the WHO, so where did you get your information from??

A chinese government website????????

And before you attack the west for not having accurate data either, well yes I agree we dont!! now you have no room to argue, unless you try a new topic thats so unrelated to this topic, and yes Ive lived in China for many years, and have now escaped its oppresive regime

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Margaret Heekin — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:14:37 GMT

Two of my very best friends are Chinese. She is from
Shanghai, He, from Taiwan. They are planning to return to their homeland as they ready for retirement not because they dont love America, but because of economics. It is not the Chinese people causing all the problems, it is a totalitarian government intent on maintaining power. These are for the most part very polite people chagrined to public displays of anger ( in particular). Their business acumen especially among the ladies is spectacular.I have also discovered tremendous generosity. My friends have offered me a place to stay in China and plan to give personal tours when I do finally make it. None of this was asked for(or even implied)just offered as a matter of friendship. Yes there have been problems but we need to travel in other peoples countries as if we were in their homes. Americans seem to have forgotten the word respect. Maybe it is our leadership of late......Industrial espionage, pollitical repression, militarism, extrajudicial detentions and "trials" please, the US has participated in ALL OF THESE and continues to. The difference: Chinese are honest about it.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Dan, Acton, CA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:17:48 GMT

Is this event about the Olympic or China? Can we just focus on the game already. The media sounds like a broken record talking about pollution and human rights over and over. Don't you think we got the point already? I'm just interested on the game. There will always be political protest in every hosting country. Protesters can protest their hearts out after the game. I believe in the game itself and want to see the competitions. China has dones so much to try and make this Olympic a success and let everyone enjoy this two week event, but seems like the media if more focus on something else then the game. Can we all just have two weeks of "Olympic Spirit"?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jay, Santa Clarita, CA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:28:36 GMT

I don't see the big deal about China blocking those political issues on the internet. Isn't the reporters there suppose to report on the game itself? Why would they need to go to Tibet or Amesty website anyways? If they want to report political issues, then why are they even there as Olympic reporters. They could just stay home to report on the political issues and not waste a real Olympic reporter space there in China.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Andy, England — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:15:05 GMT

A Patriot - somebody who loves their country.
A Nationalist - somebody who hates everybody else's country.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

John B, Orono Maine — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:50:40 GMT

Wow. If only the author of this article heard themself. First, what do you expect from a nationalistic country besides pride and patriotism? Second, why the hell would you stand on a table like that? As a guest of other nations our journalists should know better, but they just don’t care. Keep preaching to the sheep. When the wolf comes knocking at the door the sheepdog will be ready.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Susan Smith, — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 11:04:25 GMT

Having lived in China during this summer I watched with great pride the Chinese people standing up for their country during the Torch Relay in their city. You cannot make up pride like this, nor can you force people to have it. Most of the common people are just like us, trying to make a living, on, what I might add, is a pitance compared to the same job in America. True, the government is domineering to all, not just the Chinese, but the it's the people who really make China a wonderful place to visit (during non-Olympic years!).

They are allowed to worship in many cities, as some have huge Christian churches open to the public. In many places they are asked their opinion and it is taken as just that, an opinion. In many other places foreigners are welcomed as royalty, especially if they have not been allowed to visit there previously. I wish I could say we welcome legal foreigners with the same enthusiasm.

And Mike H, you must have been home-schooled because no school I ever attended taught me to hate the Chinese, or any other country's citizens.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Treb, KL Malaysia — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 11:54:13 GMT

I am so glad there are still thinking americans like Nicole from Cambridge. Wish there are many more like you Nic and the world will be a better place.

How would we act when a guest stands on our table on which we work ? Would we tolerate such an insult ?

Bye the way, We remember the friends we had in the last W war but what happened since then ? What has America been through to have so many citizens who seems to preach misundertsanding and even hate? Luckily we can see there are still quite a few good souls like Nic and we Bless you. We see the world through our own eyes and viewpoints that have been shaped by our own experience or lack of it. Let us go pay visits overseas and see it for ourself and what a difference that can make for all of us...citizens of the world

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

John Rosthern, Canada — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 12:35:48 GMT

Being yelled at has less to do with national pride than it has to do with good manners. This incident is more a display of the rude behavior of western journalists than anything else.
GET OFF THE TABLE!!!!!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bryan Williams, Colorado Springs, CO — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 12:53:35 GMT

How is Chinese national pride any different than the nonstop chants of USA USA USA in Salt Lake? Seriously, every nation does it.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Chris, Anchorage Alaska — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 12:53:53 GMT

Most of you people need to get over yourselves you are hating a country for its pride and its love for its self. Many of you need to have love and pride in your counrty instead of being sheep led around by the media and Hollywood idiots.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

James Faulkner, Roxboro, NC — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 13:08:02 GMT

You can believe that China will do all within its power to exploit the Olympics with their Nationalism, just as happened in 1936 Berlin. I see no difference. Another reason why I take exception to organized sports, the Olympics should have occurred on neutral ground. Say Athens, where it belongs every year. Big money, nationalism, and big business, all of these are the backbones of the current Olympics!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

New York City — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 13:22:47 GMT

lol at all those who think any country is truly free, can you guess how much bs get censored right here in America without you knowing? Everyones the same there is no "pure benevolent" country. Its whatever is beneficial for the gov't lets say Iraq? what was that about not to mention the human rights bs in Guantanamo Bay? etc? No country is innocent. Don't be so naive. In any country you are expendable as long as its for the greater good. Or if you have connections to the important people. Otherwise you're just a statistic paying your taxes, eatting, working, dieing. Thats it.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Seb, France — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 13:28:01 GMT

I guess no country is perfect and all stupid people pretend theirs is.
And btw, 86% of Chinese thinks their country is headed in the right direction, they don't think it's perfect (those who do are indeed stupidly nationalist).
Even tho China still got big problems (pollution, human rights violation, safety standards), as May Lee pointed out, their progress these last 20 years are astonishing.
Yes, USA are ahead concerning individual liberties, democracy etc, but would you say it has been headed in the right direction these last eight years ?
I dont.

And what about Reagan foreign policy during the LA Olympics ? and black people in cages in the 1889 World fair in Paris ?

Nobody is perfect, and everybody deserve respect. My internet isnt censored, I'd rather use it to profess tolerance than hate.
And I wont be watching the games, only because I got better things to do.

Peace.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Donald Colorado Springs CO. — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 13:36:17 GMT

I believe that China needs some work but every country has it's problems.And yes I have run into very rude chinese people but they aren't the only rude people out there.I hope the games go well for the athletes and records are broken.I'ts a shame that we can't hear more from the reguler citizen from China a country should be able to handle criticism without the need of feeling threatened.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

ryan — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:00:03 GMT

anybody that reads this article is clearly into the beijing olympics, so stop lying about boycotting the games.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

KO, Bridgeport ,CT — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:08:40 GMT

why is a picture of a young chinese girl distributing flags with the Olympic Logo labeled a "Future nationalist youth?" Firstly she is distributing flags with the Olympic logo not the Chinese flag. Secondly why is it bad for a person to be patriotic. Don't you see people displaying American flags in their front lawn, putting one on their jacket lapels etc. Are those people virulently nationalistic (in a fascist way) as this 8 year old girl is?

WOW this article is so unbalanced.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Russell — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:22:09 GMT

The idiot should not be standing on the table in the first place. What you see is a reaction to the "ugly american". Why not sent some reporters over that have had some cultural training. They could then report the news rather than their response to cultural shock.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Salisu Chindo, Kano, Kano State, Nigeria — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:34:21 GMT

It's still unfortunate that people in the west think that they are better off. How on earth will somebody from another country simply becos he wants to paint china with BLACK paint, climb on a table meant for a surppose, too snap shoots. When told to step down feels offended. Comon Americans don't think you are better off. We are poeple like you and even better off.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Susan, Scituate, MA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:48:28 GMT

Everyone concerned about China's human rights violations should take an unbiased look at what America is doing. We currently have a larger prison population than China based on the percentage of population, we have a concentration camp of Muslims in Cuba, we have secret prisons all over the world, we invaded a soverign country to steal their oil and bombed the living hell out of it displacing millions of people which other countries are forced to absorb because we won't let them in the US, even if they helped us in Iraq. Shall I go on? American citizens are blindly patriotic even when confronted with the stark reality of the offences of their country all over the world. Also if any one thinks that our media isn't as full of propaganda as China's just listen to FOX News for a half hour. Is there anything that resembles a free press any more? Thankfully the internet is still basically uncontrollable, even (which I found out when I was there) in China.Maybe we all need to stop pointing a finger and look at the four fingers pointing back at ourselves when we do so. I wish the Chinese a successful Olympics and welcome to a world united to promote more and more goodwill between nations. Haven't we had enough of division, negativity and war? I have.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

CM, Providence, RI — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 14:49:51 GMT

Many Chinese want to leave their country by every means. The wealthy and corrupt officials send their children and money to foreign countries like Australia, USA and Canada. They are all phonies, their only care is themselves not China.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Gary, Summerfield, Florida — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 15:01:27 GMT

I agree with JB, the cameraman was using very poor taste to stand on a table. Media people are accustomed to running over anyone who gets in their way in our Country and it is wrong here and wrong there. I applaud the Chinese for telling the cameraman to show some respect and culture which he apparently doesn't have.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Gary Farmer — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 15:06:32 GMT

America needs to wake up in a big way. Roughly 80% of all manufacturing in China is either owned by or controlled by facets of the Chinese military. When you buy your cheap "made in China" junk a WalMart you are funding the next ex-soviet submarine they buy, or the next tank they build. We MUST STOP BUYING CHINESE MECHANDISE and start buying American.
www.howtobuyamerican.com and www.madeinusa.com can help.

If you think I'm being an alarmist, think about this: My daughter is dating a young chinese man (20s) who has been in this country for 4 years. He's a nice enough kid, but he has told her that it is a matter of absolute certaintly to the youth of China that 1.) They will retake Taiwan sometime in the next 15-20 years and 2.) They will go to war with the US in the next 20-30 years. This is straight from the horse's mouth folks.

We are funding their military buildup every time we buy something made in China.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

LTC, Apollo, PA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 15:22:09 GMT

I've tried reading the majority of the posts here and I must contribute my thoughts. I was a graduate student at Beijing University in 1998. It was my first and, to this point, only trip to China. Was I shocked by anything negative that I saw? You bet I was - the smog was horrendous, much worse than any other place on the planet. And I've been to a lot of other countries. I came down with really intense bronchitis due to this. But you know what? My professors at Beijing University actually cared about me and tried to help me get or at least feel better. That was not the norm here at home. In fairness, our air is indeed in much better condition so that such an illness is not my norm here. What else was really bad? A lot of things that are just as objectionable here in the States - human rights abuses, animal abuse, the poor having to make do with whatever they can scrounge. There are many things that we as Americans will not accept here based on our past, what we have come to expect based on our laws, our founding documents, our unique history. But the Chinese have their own past, their own laws (not democratically determined, but that's another piece of the pie), their own sense of what is acceptable in their everyday lives. We do not have to agree with or respect the rampant corruption in the Chinese government - we don't have to accept it in our government. However, we can change our government much more easily and quickly than the Chinese people can change theirs. And they do indeed recognize many of the problems their government has and is perpetuating across the country, including censorship, graft and corruption, etc. But they recognize and appreciate foreigners who behave with politeness, respect, common sense, and decorum. I was able to participate in free discussions with whomever I wished about whatever we wished to talk about. The Chinese are proud to be Chinese - just as (most)Americans are proud to be Americans. What is wrong with this? Why are are so many Americans becoming increasingly intolerant and hyper-judgmental? This country is NOT perfect - come to think of it, no country is perfect. We ALL must understand and accept that some things are just different, some things will change but slowly, and our priorities often do not coincide with the priorities of the Chinese people. But getting to know the everyday Chinese people is an experience that I would never trade, and I hope to go back soon.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

D.K., Oregon — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 15:30:42 GMT

Heres some advice my mother gave me a long time ago." Before critizing anyone or anything, look in a mirror"

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Charles Mulhern — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 16:01:11 GMT

My wife and I just returned from a nine day trip to Beijing. The people were wonderful. We went by ourselves and felt completely safe wandering the streets. My wife is blond and at several times we had parents asking if they could snap a photo of their children with her. The city is going through an amazing transformation. Some of the new buildings being built there are spectacular. They have made huge progress in the last twenty years. I just hope some of the future progress is in personal freedoms and on environmental issues. I hope the games are a huge success not for the governments sake but for the citizens of China.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Marsh, Des Moines, IA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 16:03:39 GMT

The Chinese people have a lot to be proud of. Their nation is set to overtake the US as the world's largest economy in the near future. Construction on such a grand scale hasn't been seen in the US in decades.

The Chinese people are typically friendly and kind hearted. All these things being said, there is no excuse for the atrocities the govt. commits against its dissenting citizens. If 86 percent are satisfied, wonderful. What about the Christians? They are imprisoned and murdered just because the govt. doesn't like them. The same with anyone willing to openly chriticize the govt.

Let the Chinese be patriotic. They have the right, but by all means do not give the govt. a free pass.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Lisa Klien Boston, MA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 17:47:14 GMT

Let's see, did China invade another country (Iraq), on the basis of lies, did over 100 thousand civilians (Iraqi Civilians) meet their deaths thru collateral damage by American Armed forces.

So before we as Americans begin to be critical with Economic Powerhouse that is China, let's take a look at all the blood on our hands.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Sir Fredderick Swimmingly III, New Orleans, LA — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 20:00:37 GMT

I don't see what all the fuss is about, "ohh China this and China that". The US has hosted, so has England, Mexico, Germany, Australia, Spain, Russia, Japan, Italy and France have hosted the Olympics. Each one of these countries have had their own histories of killing numerous people at home and abroad. My advise is this, let's all sit back and watch people compete in sports we've never heard of and know nothing about. I will be watching the Olympics and rooting for my country, rooting for the underdogs and being very impressed with the personal stories of achievement.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

upset citizen,Miami — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 20:20:48 GMT

I believe that America should stop wasting their time and money on a country that has done nothing for us, and concentrate on the damage that we have caused on nations that were once our friends, and now sworn enemies thanks to american patriotism.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

S. — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 20:44:00 GMT

Many of these comments about China are shamefully ignorant and expose an equally biased media which has done a sad job of educating Americans and the world about the realities of China. This country has no intention of taking over the world or being a threat of any kind to the U.S. I have lived in China and found these people to be the most kind and hospitable in the world. There is no doubt that they are trying to improvie their quality of life - hardly something the U.S. can criticize. The China of today is going through the industrial revolution and the information age at the same time. If Americans wish to cast stones, perhaps they should look at themselves first.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Athos, Addison, IL — Thu, 31 Jul 2008 21:03:27 GMT

Neal,

The 1936 Olympics were held in Berlin, not Munich. Munich was the host of the 1972 summer games in which the Israeli athletes were kidnapped and killed.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Flannery,Seattle, — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 01:45:34 GMT

Please not say anthing and just go to China to see and feel and then you will know everything and will understand everything 1

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Adam L., Penfield, ny — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 03:50:47 GMT

This article is ignorant and offensive. The caption used for the photo of the young Chinese girl is especially shameful; it targets a young child with an unqualified, negative (at least by the arguments being made by the author) label. It is akin to labeling an African American youth as a future criminal, or a German youth as a future Nazi.

Furthermore, anyone with even a basic knowledge of Chinese history knows of the humiliations and crimes committed against China, from the West's exploitation of China via the Opium Wars and the horrific crimes against humanity committed by Japan against China during WWII, crimes that Japanese conservatives continue to deny. Rising above these past humiliations certainly is something to be proud of.

Articles such as these do nothing but expose negative bias about Chinese believed by and perpetuated by the Western media. Try studying history, and not following xenophobic whims.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

john John — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 08:23:55 GMT

The banning of blacks and Mongolians from bars in Sanlitun in Beijing (the South China Morning Post)shows how racist the government in Beijing is. In minority areas of China, Tibet and Shinjung they have an Han apartheid system, bring workers for State Owned Organizations such as C.O.F.L.Co. from beijing..

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

All American in Shanghai — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 08:41:05 GMT

This is to Mary Lee:

More than 800,000,000 people in China live in abject POVERTY. So before you go lecturing others, perhaps you should get your numbers right!

And one more thing, there's a diference between 'self righteous' and 'being right'; and here you are actually correct, the Chinese are self righteous for damn sure! But they are far from being right!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Cynthia Yao, Beijing — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 09:18:34 GMT

Interesting, how could no human rights and "nationalism" happened at the same time?! Do you know anyone doesn't have basic rights but support his country so much?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Tian Xia, China — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 11:31:01 GMT

Very interesting exchange. I am an American living in China for over ten years. First came her as a student in the 80's. I have seen the good and bad sides of China. There is plenty of both.

Seems everyone talking about manners is missing the point. It wasn't that the guy jumped up on the table that upset the crowd, it was that he was taking video of an crowd that was unhappy at waiting a long time and not being served well. The crowd felt the video portrayed China in a bad light.

Seems just yesterday there were lines in cities around the world for iPhones. Many people waited for days, unhappy, pushy lines. Video broadcast all over the world... Long pushy lines happen every time there is a 50% off sale.

I think Chinese are getting really sensitive in the last few years, or they were sensitive before and now they are not holding back. Anyway, I think they should take a chill pill. So should those who blanket attack or support China.

"In the last two decades, China has lifted 1.3 billion people (over 20% of population on earth) out of poverty."

It is true, but "China" put them in poverty in the 60's and 70's. Look at the difference in living standards between Taiwan (started from similar base as China in same time frame), Japan (rebuilt their country from massive war in late 1940s), and Korea (rebuilt their country from massive war in late 1950s). Other Asian countries have come much farther faster than China.

On the other side, the Chinese countryside has a MASSIVE population. If you have been there you would know that lifting them out of poverty is a huge accomplishment. But have government policies helped or just "allowed" people to grow themselves out of poverty?

So, good and bad in China, just like in every other country.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

holy whiner — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 16:10:14 GMT

What I see is a bunch of whiners trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill.
what's wrong with people feeling proud of hosting a big party? what's wrong with people telling a rude cameraman not to stand on top of the table.

Ms. Mong, when I go to your house, what will happen if I stand on yout table top and start to film the people at your house? don't try to fool yourself.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Ricky,the earth — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 19:39:16 GMT

What i have read above was so disappointing.Well, we're all human species.It is inevitable that people hold divergent views on issues,however, the issues can be resolved on the basis of mutual respect and conprehension.we just want to live in peace and harmony.That's all.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Bridget, Minneapolis, MN. — Sat, 02 Aug 2008 19:45:14 GMT

I'm having a hard time understanding how China was granted the 2008 Olympics too. The international community should not reward their deplorable human rights record by allowing them to profit financially and politically.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Holly — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 05:51:01 GMT

I can't agree someone here at all. I am a chinese, i do not think China is so evil as u say,we can see many foreign websides,we can criticize our leaders when talking, and we treat aliens well!we r not against anyone,but u westerners think u r the world and all things in the world should follow ur way,u have distroyed many kinds of culture like indian culture,please do not force us to follow ur way,we have our own culture and own path to go, i admit american is great,but i think chinese is also great,please respect and smile to each other!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Chen Lejun, Hangzhou, China — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 09:10:04 GMT

Those who know little about China, please keep your mouth closed before you know.
We welcome your comments but you should at least know something aobut us.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

N. Adler, Chicago — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 13:45:10 GMT

It's so easy to criticize another country, especially if you've never been to it and only hear about the bias from our OWN media. Never mind the fact that our own country supports tyrannical oil mongers abroad and is personally responsible for the death of thousands of Iraqi civilians amongst other heinous acts...no, of course THOSE aren't "crimes." They were just done in the interest of "freedom," whatever that means here. Apparently our media finds it more important to bash the Chinese, who just wants some respect from the rest of the world.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

GVR, Carversville, PA — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 15:27:39 GMT

Thanks JB Texas. Why should anyone stand on a table designated for other use and get away with it. The arrogance of our media to think they can insult anyone with their manners (lack of) or indiscreet questions (arbitrary search for "truth"???)adn think theiy are the only truth.

Freedom of speech invokes the necessity to listen. In that give and take both civility and tolerance for When in Rome... should find a place.

This does not mean we should not be in Burma reporting on their atrocity....funny we've forgotten about that!!!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Gene, Mechanicsville, Va — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 16:26:20 GMT

You jump on a table at MY picnic, and I'm gonna do more than express my displeasure vocally. That seems to me to be highly disrespectful, typical of a liberal-biased media, and the root behavior causing a phenomena known as "the ugly American." I realize China's human rights' record, their treatment of their own people and others, and other drawbacks. But I'm also going to enjoy the Olympics, and hope it comes off successfully and without incident. And I sincerely hope the U. S. kicks everyone's butts in event victories and medal collections.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Gene, Mechanicsville, Va. — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 16:33:36 GMT

Talk abaout internet censorship—AFTER I posted my respnose to this story, I read the "conditions" imposed by the blogsite. Comments may go unposted because of 'moderation"? So that means what? If the opinions aren't half-and-half pro/con, they get cancelled out until they are? Or does it mean it's wrong to feel strongly about something? Hmmm, sounds like censorship to me.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

jason — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 18:59:10 GMT

well this republican thinks its time to liberate that godless society and educate them on christ its americas job to free the helpless

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Thomson Reuters, New York City — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 06:22:45 GMT

Whoever said China wil be the next financial capital of the world, you're insane. If you had any insight in the financial sector, you would know Dubai will be it. London and New York are falling.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

James, Cambridge, MA (well Qingdao, China right now) — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 08:13:31 GMT

Actually the Great Firewall of China is sort of down for the Olympic Games right now. I'm reading this from Qingdao, China.

I understand the nationalism that's gripping the country here as much as I disagree with it. There's a lot of history here behind it, and nationalism is not the same as support for the government--go read the article about complaints about the games and how the government is handling them; trust me, it's everywhere. But even the people who complain about the games are quick to defend their country if they believe an outsider is insulting China's limelight (think about how you'd react if a foreigner unknowingly put an American flag on the ground as a picnic blanket? Yea, roughly the same thing).

And OmegaSector, those industrial chinese "spies", most of them came to the US in the wake of Tiananmen. It sounds to me like every non-white non-neoNazi is actually a foreign spy in your mind.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Tom — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 10:15:56 GMT

As a lawyer working internationally, I can tell you the greatest reduction in civil rights (and consequently innumerable crimes have been committed) over the past two decades has been led by the none other than the American legistlator.

As a well travelled Australian (I have been to China a numebr of times) living in Europe and the Middle East and working with a number of Chinese companies for the last decade, I still dont fully understand their complex culture and approach to life. What I can say is that it is rich, vibrant and fascinating with all the idiosyncracies and and insecurities that come with a recently turbulent history. Accept their differences and appreciate their really fantastic culture.

This thread on the other hand is appalling. With a few notable exceptions, the dim-witted hypocrticial ignorance and specious argument made by a number of the commentators left me speechless. With respect, the validity of such opinions is really lost when no education, personal or life experience or objectivity is inherent whatseover. Go out, read a few books, talk to a few people who have actually been there (maybe even some of the Chinese devils themselves), go to the country if you can, open your eyes objectively and forget your inbuilt racism and then form an opinion.

This is a manifestation of the very reasons Americans are hated around the world at the moment, many of the commentators here should be ashamed of themselves.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Rusty Freedom, Toldeo, Ohio — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 19:05:57 GMT

>> well this republican thinks its time to liberate that godless society and educate them on christ its americas job to free the helpless
>> jason (Sent Sunday, August 03, 2008 2:59 PM)

Great idea Jason! However it was tried before with disapointing results (RE: the Taipeng Rebellion). A a treaty between China and the Opium Dealers (RE: the Opium Wars) included the clause that forced China to allow Christiam missionaries into the country along with the opium.

A great movement spread and the followers of Christ declared war on the 'heathens'. All told, 20 million Chinese who would not submit to Jesus were murdered and liberated from life!

How many innocent people do you estimate would REALLY convince the Chinese people of the great love of Jesus?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Chris, Orlando, FL — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 20:01:36 GMT

Any nation which is currently pursuing a genocidal agenda should be automatically disqualified from even participating in the Olympics, much less hosting them. Until the colonization of Tibet with Han Chinese ceases, China should be treated like the fascist, polluting country it is.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Nanson Hwa — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 21:23:29 GMT

One thing I have learned while living in America. There is constant inconsistency with respect to criticism and standards. One standard for America and another standard for all other countries.

One can thank the press and media for brainwashing the gullible readers and where "the united minority rules the divided majority."

The Olympic games is where the finest athletes from different countries can compete and bring with them the sense of national pride and patriotism to share with the rest of the world.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Jay, Houston, TX — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 22:11:10 GMT

The Olympics are about the world coming together to compete in a friendly way. Just thank God that you live in a country that is so rich it can support it's own citizens, 22 million illegal immigrants, pays 75% of the Mexican GDP and can still send billions of hard working taxpayer's dollars to Africa! Any olympic victories for the US in China are truly victories for the great people of Mexico, Iraq, Palestine (yes we give them lots of money too) Indonesia, Africa and all the other countries whose citizens would like to see us dead. I have no patriotism left in me for the US. We are the world's biggest pushovers. I love our troops but they are fighting for a country that we're giving away.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Daniel Doe, Portland, Oregon — Mon, 04 Aug 2008 23:24:28 GMT

China may be headed in the "general" right direction but it still isn`t but it still could be acomplishing a lot more like leaving Tibet and Taiwan alone and cutting all of the propaganda and being more proactive in it`s enviromentalism, after all if China doesn`t do any thing than the world`s new status would be "screwed"

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Michael, World Citizen — Tue, 05 Aug 2008 04:49:26 GMT

Boxing Rebellion. Yes, that was terrible. Who started that? Oh, Chinese nationals who thought they were invincible started killing missionaries, foreigners and any Chinese person who seemed to have relation to them, Christians, Catholics, etc...
China has a great ability to rewrite history, brainwash its citizens, and never forget the things afflicted against it. Its memory of its offenses however are easily forgiven and denied. We are great and all have always stepped on us. If we might have stepped on someone else then they deserved it. Leave us alone, you only want to bring us down.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Adam Z, Shanghai, China — Tue, 05 Aug 2008 08:28:57 GMT

I am a Chiness lived in shanghai. I am not going to defend for my government, because I don't like it at all. I just have some words after reading all threads above.

1. Olympic is a feast for all peace-like human beings. Participating any of Olympic Games is a beautiful dream of most athelets of the world. So no matter what you think of my motherland is, PLEASE think of the athetes' feeling. Don't curse it (as someone did here)

2. Please do some research before you make any conclusion of something you are not familiar with. Do not make judgement only based on personal perceptions or one-sided stories. We Chinese people used to believe in very biased stories by the government, but now most of us have learnt to be objective. We are more and more willing to hear opinions from both sides and we can access most Internet resourses (some are banned though).

3. I am not going to debate whose opinion is correct and it is never possible for all people to own a same or even a similar viewpoint. So, instead of fighting each other endlessly, why don't we keen our differences and achieve our commons?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Richard, Boston — Tue, 05 Aug 2008 10:21:10 GMT

Lao Zi, Buddha, Christ, all of the great spiritual prophets left us the same great wisdom - love your neighbor, be compassionate...

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Ashley — Tue, 05 Aug 2008 10:38:27 GMT

"But it seemed surprising that they would vent their anger at a foreign news crew ..."

I fail to see how being foreign excludes one from being criticized for a idiotically rude maneuver. I mean, seriously.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

pierre , mauritius — Tue, 05 Aug 2008 15:22:56 GMT

thank you OEA....your words are most righteous ...

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Ryan Hughes, Shanghai, China — Tue, 05 Aug 2008 15:31:56 GMT

My opinion as a foreigner studying in Shanghai:

1.) Nationalism has grown 10x:

It resulted in local students condescending foreigners. This has changed from a "wow" to a "so what, we have it too"

But they don't say that FOREIGNERs built their cities and gave them technology. They innovated nothing! Only copy (many times pirating) so to catch up to the world (space tech from russia, high tech/tv from taiwan, trade from usa) and not thanking them, but still holding on the old past bitterness.

2.) Anti-Japanese, Anti-Taiwanese, Anti-Foreigner growth in students here.

I had one of my classmates say: "I dont want to eat lunch with you foreigners...." and later to find that they don't won't foreigners to feel that we are so special that chinese wants to eat with them... I was shocked.

During my classes, the teacher was speaking of how America deserved 9-11 because of being a world bully... in front of the whole class and the students agreed... this is CHINA's nationalism

3.) Both worlds need to learn:

Yes, America has its own problems but we should definitely learn from china to PROTECT OUR SELF INTERESTS and not welfare ourselves out. Just look at the communists, they protect every aspect of their "n ational" interests. I hope the new president will do this.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Sharon, Denver — Tue, 05 Aug 2008 19:45:48 GMT

I am a Chinese. I can understand where the hypersensitivity is from. The past humiliating history plays a part of it. But more than anything, many Chinese very much loop up to the western free world; hence western culture and values. Since the early 80s, everything about American and the rest of the western world has been fancier and better to us Chinese. We have been working very hard trying to be part of you. Just like a naïve poor and unpopular kid, we actually admire you westerners. That’s why it hurts so much when all we have heard is negative remarks from you.

When you are using the western standards to judge China, don’t forget China is not just about Chinese government. There are, above all, 1.3 billion Chinese people and that piece of land. With that said, my parents still live in China. So I obviously do not appreciate anyone suggests the smog should be thicker there.

Speaking of history, Dalai Lama, 21 years old before he left Tibet in 1959, owned the most slaves. That is why I will have to take my time to understand what he can bring to Tibet before I pick a side.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Henry Wang, Chengdu, China — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 04:13:42 GMT

Why is everybody so mad at this? There is no way to guide a coutry with 1.3 billion popullation without making mistakes.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

clover,Shenzhen, China — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 06:49:05 GMT

I'm Chinese.I love my country and our goverment. The goverment is not so bad as reported in the west. Our lives is getting better and we're making progress to become a demoratic socity.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

mike omak wa — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 09:14:53 GMT

there is nothing wrong with having national pride we in the us have it what is wrong with other countries having it?
as to the camera man standing on a table, would you like it if i stood on your table before you sat down and ate dinner
you are in another country so you are representing us in the usa , next time take some lessons from ann landers on etiquette before you travel to another country and embaress us

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Big-T — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 15:01:11 GMT

Wonder what happened to the 14% of Chinese citizens interviewed who DIDN'T go along with the "I'm a happy citizen" thing? How many soldiers do you think accompanied the interviewers?

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

John Ritter — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 15:39:19 GMT

? It only gets worse as time goes on, we are destined to kill each other. Humanity that is, the shadows of a darker time roll across the horizon like the ebbing of the tide. If you think it is bad now just wait it will get worse. just watch for awhile you'll sooner or later get a glimpse of it

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

samwell T — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 01:07:17 GMT

What is the Chinese government so afraid of that they empty the city and allows only “safe population” to stay; stirring up extreme nationalism and tries to intimidate all, the locals and foreigners? Are they really worried about attacks from Tibetans? Uyghur? foreigner? No way! They are worried about sparks of freedom and justice falling on dry hays and cause huge fires (this is their own say). The grass root Chinese are more than often on the verge with their government, but too dangers to say anything or do anything about it (plenty of horror memories in resent history), The government redirect people‘s resentments towards outsiders…using nationalism plus intimidations. The combination is quite effective given the fact that ordinary Chinese understand little beyond China FOR REAL because of their media control.

There are plenty of sharp Chinese holds similar views as that brave writer Ma Jian’s (?) except they live inside the country and they are in dark. They speculate the truths … whisper in private.

The communist party’s internal power struggle also requires such a hysterical nationalism campaign as a cover…

It is dangers unless, they somehow reform their system, insert a dynamic new structure defueling their internal power struggles and lead the system stepping into plural setting (Not yet to talking about democracy), calm and stability would be there.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Wai Beijing — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 13:36:52 GMT

An internatioal executive working in China for the last 25 years, key points to remember when looking at China -

- At present, ordinally Chinese people has the best living condition for the last 100+ years - A key measurement for any "good" government .

- The present GDP/Captia in China is USD2,500, an economic/living condition 50 to 60 years ago in US/Europe ? Think about the social, legal and environmental benchmark now and then.

- A good comparison with China is India - huge population, long civilization, and starting around the same economic base in 50's.

Then all these "strange things" in China are in a better perspective.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Shanghai — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 08:07:49 GMT

No one has mentioned the article in the South China Morning Post about Beijing authorities ordering bars not to serve blacks and Mongolians!!!!

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

kate san jose — Sun, 10 Aug 2008 18:44:54 GMT

The hardest part about the opening ceremonies was watching the Chinese children being paraded in, knowing nothing about Tibet, government control, torture....paraded in like puppets, just like the guy on the string lighting the torch.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Frank — Wed, 13 Aug 2008 08:31:03 GMT

Sometimes i am really tired to respond to such naive idea of westerners. As I worked in China for so many year, i know their mass-media cannot be trusted. But the same question, can western mass media be trusted 100%??
Think this question again, I suggest your people. Think independently, and try to travel Tibet and talked to local people. See how many Tibetans want the "independence" and "freedom" so called by yourselves. Americans have been manipulated by their some politicians and mass media (which were control by some power elite) for so long. As for Vienam War, Iraq War and so on. Do not be fooled again. Chinese government is not a saint, neither is Uncle Sam and Dalai Lama.

Why these might be the ‘Nationalism Games’

Judy Stonington,CT — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:27:03 GMT

"and yes China cracks down on Tibet, because they conquered it 600 years ago, we crack down on Mexican immigrants through the Southern states, and we only conquered it 150 years ago."
I believe, actually, that the only MEXICAN IMMIGRANTS we are interested in are the ILLEGAL ones... and the southern states weren't really so much 'conquered' as brought into the Union and made equal partners. (states)
This equates to a different scenario altogether from Tibet and China