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Inside the Taliban's 'grave error'

Posted: Friday, April 24, 2009 1:12 PM
Filed Under:

ISLAMABAD – After weeks of consolidating their control over large areas of the Northwest Frontier Province, the Taliban are in retreat.

On Friday, Maulana Fazullah, the firebrand Taliban boss in the Swat Valley, ordered his most trusted military chief, Commander Fateh, to leave Buner, a neighboring valley that Fateh seized on Monday.

The Pakistani authorities warned the militants on Thursday that they were ready to remove them by force if they did not lay down their arms and abide by a peace agreement hammered out in February.

Image: Taliban militants hold their weapons outside the mosque where tribal elders and the Taliban met in Daggar, Buner's main town, Pakistan
Mohammad Sajjad / AP
Taliban militants hold their weapons outside a mosque in Daggar, Buner's main town on Thursday. 
 
According to the deal, the government ceded power to the Taliban in the Swat Valley and allowed them to impose Islamic law in the area in return for a cease-fire – ending two years of on and off military operations there.

But last weekend at a large gathering of supporters in the valley, the Taliban announced they would not lay down their arms and openly challenged the state. They declared that democracy was un-Islamic and called for harsh Islamic laws, known as sharia, to replace Pakistan’s constitution.

The next day, they began their advance into Buner. That valley’s proximity to the capital, Islamabad, just 70 miles and a five-hour drive away, sounded alarm bells in Washington.

A step too far
 
"The Taliban finally made a grave error," said Javed Siddiq, editor of the influential Urdu language daily Nawa-e-Waqt.  "Once they challenged Pakistan’s constitution as un-Islamic, Islamic scholars and the Pakistani people no longer saw them as the self-styled defenders of Islam against western infidels – but infidels themselves who want to dismantle the Pakistani state."

Siddiq said that challenging the constitution was a wrong step and believes it has backfired. Pakistan’s constitution was carefully forged by a board of Islamic scholars in 1973 – every tenet was crafted to make sure it conformed to the principals of Islam.

"Now, all the different sects of the Sunni and Shiite, the religious scholars, the army, the politicians and every Pakistani is against the Taliban," Siddiq said. "They have lost."

The Taliban were quick to sense their blunder and the resulting sea change in the country. "The expansion into Buner was the turning point," said Siddiq.

Image: Taliban Commander Fateh in Buner, Pakistan.
NBC News
Taliban Commander Fateh in Buner, Pakistan.

‘No ordinary Taliban commander’
It was soon after the Taliban signed the February peace agreement with the Pakistani government that Commander Fateh began to plan the militants’ move into Buner.

"I saw Swat as an opening for us," Fateh told NBC News in a recent interview. "I knew if I planned well, we would be able to advance little by little, hopefully in a peaceful way, and gradually enforce Islam in the valley."

Fateh, a 33-year-old native of Swat, rose up through the ranks of Taliban fighters after almost 15 years of fighting in Afghanistan. The somber-looking commander, who is married with three sons, is considered to be an accomplished military strategist, often brilliant in battle, according to Taliban commanders in the region.

With the bearing of a de-facto prince exacting homage from his subjects, Fateh, whose name means victorious in Urdu, rode into Buner last Monday in the back seat of a black Toyota pick-up truck. Taliban fighters flanked his vehicle and brandished Kalashnikovs at the throngs of locals who had come out to catch a glimpse of him.  

Fateh was meticulously turned out in a silky black turban that hung low on his clean, pressed tunic. He wore expensive-looking light brown leather ankle boots, and his long black beard gave off a heady smell of musk-scented oil in the afternoon sun.

"This was no ordinary Taliban commander," said an NBC cameraman, who caught up with Fateh in Buner.  "Most of them are scruffy. This guy was different. I wanted to ask him where he got his shoes."

VIDEO: As concern grows over Taliban in Pakistan, Adm. Mike Mullen discusses the threat with NBC's Ann Curry

Blazing a path of fear
Fateh’s plan was to peacefully take Buner with 800 Taliban fighters. After consulting with Fazullah and a council of elders, Fateh and his men drove the 25 miles from Swat to Buner in a convoy of cars, pick-up trucks and mini-buses. Fateh ordered a few hundred men to walk over the mountains and prepare for meeting the Pakistani army along the way, but they encountered no resistance.

"I always try to take control without firing a single shot," Fateh said outside the villa of a wealthy Buner businessman that became his military headquarters just hours after arriving in Buner. "My orders to my men are first and foremost, try not to kill."

Fateh easily forced a truce with the tribal elders and sent home some of his men. He then gave NBC News a tour of the area to show that the local people were with the Taliban.

"We prefer the sharia law that the Taliban have brought to us because it provides speedy justice and no one demands money from us," said Sultan Mehmud, a shopkeeper in Buner.

"Before, we would have to go into debt hiring corrupt government lawyers to defend us, and we never received any justice," he said, albeit haltingly, obviously terrified to say anything against the Taliban.

The Taliban have consistently beheaded those who do not conform to their rules – which include outlawing music and forbidding men to shave their beards – and have torched schools and government buildings in their path.

Less than 1 million people live in Buner, an impoverished valley in the Malakand Division of the Northwest Frontier Province. But Buner has huge strategic importance because it borders seven other districts, enabling the Taliban to easily spread their influence.

The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Adm. Mike Mullen told NBC News in an interview broadcast on Friday that he is extremely concerned about indications that the Taliban are moving closer to Islamabad.

Army threat
Pakistan’s army commanders have repeatedly said that the army is ready to go back in to push back the militants – whose numbers in Swat alone are estimated to be close to 10,000. On Friday, they deployed around Buner to secure government installations, but so far they have not received any orders from the civilian government to launch a military operation.

In a strongly worded statement, Pakistan’s army chief, Gen. Ashfaq Kayani, warned Friday that no one should mistake a pause in military operations as a concession to the militants.

"The army is determined to root out the menace of terrorism from the society," Kayani said in the statement.  "It will not allow the militants to dictate terms to the government or impose their way of life on the civil society of Pakistan." 

A Pakistani army officer, who asked to remain anonymous because he is not authorized to speak to the media, said Kayani’s statement was directed at the politicians who are criticizing the army and at Western voices who are describing a doomsday scenario for Pakistan. "The chief’s statement was basically a ‘shut-up’ call," he said.

NBC News’ Fakhar Rehman in Islamabad contributed to this report.

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Comments

Perhaps the US should allow Muslims to impose sharia in certain areas of Minnesota. It certainly seems to have worked well in Pakistan.
there must be roads in and out of buner- why didnt the pakistani military set up an ambush? or call in an airstrike on the taliban convoy? am i missing something?
Wait - hyperconservative religious fanatics attempt to impose their will on the population at large - you mean this is now considered a BAD thing by Americans?
So a deal was made with the devil and he didn't keep his end of the bargain?  I'm just shocked. Who could have imagined it would have turned out this way?  It's about time people got a cold slap in the face concerning the Taliban and Al Queda and their "religious motivations" for world control.  And they think they are serving God.  Wait.  Isn't it prophesied in the Christians bible that these people would come?  And in the end they perish.    
Pakistan's Zardari is a fool to have let the Taliban establish Sharia Law in the Swat Valley.  I hope he's learned his lesson that the religious fantatics who want sharia law can never be trusted to abide by their false agreements.

Hopefully Zardari will come to his senses and clean up the Swat Valley and reestablish secular law to protect the women from persecution by the male chauvinist pigs who cling to their korans and guns.  Hmmm the Taliban sound a lot like our socially conservative evangelical lunatic fringers.  Maybe we should ship them all over there where they can revel in religious tyranny.

Just Say No to Religious Law!
I have been to Pakistan, as for north as Lahore. There are some very fancy hotel-sized houses there, complete with an armed guard, also some trendy restaurants. On the other hand, most of the population lives in extreme poverty with transportation by ox carts. I have never seen worse, even in India. Considering the poverty that exists, how can the Taliban be stopped? I think it is only a matter of time until they take over. The same goes for Afghanistan, which may become Obama's Iraq. In Iraq we had to contend with a population of 25 million. In Pakistan, the population is 170,000 million. There is no way the US can help as we will be stuck in Iraq for many years to prevent a civil war, the first phase of which has already begun.
Pakistan is a failing State and it will have catastrophic impact in neighboring India. Pakistan can not be saved. Thanks to the U. S. policies for decades in that part of the world.
if the people didt get justice and believe me there was and is no justice at all in Pakistan then these types of reactions always came from society. and this is our right to implement our islamic law in our country and no one has the right to dictate us and vice versa.
It is the responsibility of the Pakistani people to bear the brunt of ensuring their own freedom.I have no problem with us assisting them;howvere I have a big problem with us fighting their war while thay sit back and wait to see the results.Freedom comes at a price and we should not be paying it.
Who in their right mind would believe anything that the Taliban terrorists say? And who would make a deal with these deranged Jihadis? Would you buy a used car from them? This is propaganda, pure and simple. Unless the Taliban are decisively defeated they will escalate the violence, and overthrow the Pakistani government. This would be an immense tragedy for the people of Pakistan. And if their nuclear weapons fell into the hands of these psychopaths, it would pose a clear danger to the civilized world. They must be defeated
Hey Dave in NM,
Funny comparison but Silly to compare anti-abortion, anti-stem cell research and pro prayer in school with stoning people, cutting off of hands and feet, no education for girls and killing of girls and women who act in ways men don't agree with. Oh, and when given the chance the killing of infidels, i.e. Jews, christians, Hindus and Athiests.
how  is  the   taliban  and  Al Queda  getting   their  hands  on  large  amounts  of  US  cash  ??
is this  just  another  CIA  attempt at  falase  flag  operation: the  Nato-trucks  and  weapons are  being  stolen  at  will the  band  of  80-144  men  are  ruleing  the  whole  country ....9/11  was  an  inside  job...??
I agree Lee and I do hope they perish or at least their movement does. All through the Bush administration we were told how afraid we should be of Iraq, the terrorism threat, etc., and for the most part I think it was mainly political rhetoric designed to keep in power. However, this is a very real threat with little doubt as to how serious it is. The thought of the Taliban gaining control of a nuclear state is very alarming. I cannot imagine it getting that far, but it certainly bears watching. I imagine India is watching this very closely as well.
The fear of the taliban is their close connection to Al Queda and their quest to rule Pakistan and use the atomic bombs as their persuasive lever in the region. I wonder if the US could convince or bribe Pakistan to destroy their atom bombs so that goal can be erased? Pakistan's army doesn't seem angry enough to go after the taliban so it's a matter of time till they rule Pakistan. Perhaps 2 to 3 years.
"Pakistan is a failing State and it will have catastrophic impact in neighboring India. Pakistan can not be saved. Thanks to the U. S. policies for decades in that part of the world. "
@ Bob
Why is it that you say -he U.S. is to blame for the Taliban invaders now?!
Kinda twisted logic...
Can anyone not see this was done on purpose!? Isnt it obvious that they allowed the implementation of Sharia in those tribal areas becauese they knew this would happen? Come on folks just because they are from Pakistan and not American it doesnt make then stupid! We all seem to think we know how this part of the world works more then they do. I think we have all failed to realize that these people have been living this way far before our "awesome" country existed. Just like we wont change our cruel and evil ways, neither will they. The end.
"Pakistan is a failing State and it will have catastrophic impact in neighboring India. Pakistan can not be saved. Thanks to the U. S. policies for decades in that part of the world. "
@ Bob
Why is it that you say -he U.S. is to blame for the Taliban invaders now?!
Kinda twisted logic...
I don't believe for one moment that the Taliban are "in retreat". They stepped into that province just to show that they could. It was their way of sending a signal to the Pakistani government (who is apparently terrified of these people). I guarantee you, that unless the Pakistani government comes out of its deep denial, the Taliban will have effective control over all of Pakistan and soon.
No Western powers have ever defeated what are now collectively referred to as Afghans. The British attempted it on at least three occasions and got whipped. And we all know that the Russians (Soviets) were there for ten years until 1989 and received a terrible beating. Then along comes the U.S. looking for Osama after 9/11.  (Remember it was the U.S. who armed Osama and others to fight the Russians).  So far we have failed to catch Osama, and even if we did there are many more (and probably worse) people to take his place.  Also, we have been pushing the propaganda that if we are there, the bad guys cannot do another 9/11.  This propaganda is so stupid it is almost beyond belief, but a susbtantial number of Americans have been sucked in by it.  Clearly, we need to vacate Iraq and Afghanistan but we probably won't until we are so bloodied and broke that we will have no choice. We will find out that it is impossible to remake Islamic/Muslim societies in our image. What a shame that our a--hole politicians in Washington, DC will have learned nothing over the dead and maimed bodies of Americans and Afghans.  We need to get the hell out of Afghanistan and Iraq and let the peoples there determine their own destinies, now matter how much it will hurt our great collective American ego that keeps telling us erroneously that we can remake the world.  Time to go home and fix America!!  We are going to end up in Afghanistan just like the Russians did.  We spit into the wind by arming and helping the Afghans fight the Russians from 1979 to 1989, and now history is coming back to smack us in the mouth.  
Bob you make me laugh, it is not the US that is causing Pakistan to fail, it is the Pakistani government. Their people are too afraid of conflict that they are willing to sacrifice military, morality, and their way of life to allow the Taliban to take over their country. While I am not against peace, there should atleast be something these people are willing to fight for (too bad all those things I mentioned above aren't any of them).
To Eric Salinas, I agree with your evaluation right up to the point where you started the religous bashing. The Monday Morning Quaterbacks are the ones that need to take a turn in the barrel and fight. I did and it gave me great insight about how these people think.  
Good point, Ray in KS.

Afghanistan and Pakistan are in the strategic lgocation where an international liquid natural gas pipeline will be completed by late 2011. Right now the US is building its bases to guard it and setting up local, provincial, and national puppets for its strategic interests. Iraq was the first staging arena. Now the Taliban are the "Last of Mohicans" who have to make their brave stand against economic imperialism before getting hauled off to their permanent reservation.
What Mr Ray Manhattan say are true, it IS hard to reshape the devil, only God can punish them.
It seems that if the world support the majority of Pakistanis in imposing a blockade and other economic sanctions and taking military action in support of the law, that these anti-democratic traitors could be stopped.
Denial is not just a river in Egypt--Pakistan is clearly delusional about the Taliban and any power they have to control them!!

 They have the majority of their military on their Eastern Border with India and still haven't noticed the country being taken over from their Western Border.  Will they ever notice who their REAL enemy is...probably not. Meanwhile, let's see if they throw another chunk of Pakistan to the Taliban to "pacify" them.
And where were the CIA drones when the 800 fighters
made their way to from Swat to Burner in their convoy? A missed opportunity?
Dear Ben Canada,
Where in Islam does it say that all that extremeism is right???? Its quite ignorant of you to make such judgements before even having enough information to back it up. I myself am a practicing Muslim and I teach young children every Saturday about our beautiful religion. Just like every other religion Islam is peaceful and kind, all that extremeism goes fully against our beliefs. Learn something before you speak!!!
What an interesting assortment to comments!!!Typically American--- Free Speech at it's best. Now for a 75 yrs young grandma who is facing a MAJOR surgery in 25 days=== This may sound like a very harsh feeling but, I'm fed up with bsiling out deadbeats who kill their own most productive citizens, and denie their own WOMEN education, health care, equal rights,etc.  

As far ad I,m concerned, Lets build a large fence around the entire MIDDLE EAST area and PAKISTAN/Afghanistan area and let them settle their own difference-----I don't like the idea of my descendancs paying for this insanity for the the next
It is a failing black mail attempt from Pakistan to ask for money for their army. The real prize in the middle east is Saudi Arabia. We are being manipulated in thinking differently. If the Taliban take over Pakistan, they will ride over the Saudi royals so fast. It is the intent that Sharia law rules, no room for royals. They would take over the oil exports and revenues and push forward. I think the real problem is for China. Once the extremists make headway in poltical control, the masses of Chinese will rise up against their armies and overthrow Chinese military. I think the extremists know they have to move now before we find sustainable alternative fuels. They know that without money and no industry they will perish. Iran will vote in new leaders and with their intelligent young population the ideology and religious dogmas will lose and significance. I do think that the Taliban has just a few years or even months before the outside world eliminates them once and for all.
What an interesting assortment to comments!!!Typically American--- Free Speech at it's best. Now for a 75 yrs young grandma who is facing a MAJOR surgery in 25 days=== This may sound like a very harsh feeling but, I'm fed up with bsiling out deadbeats who kill their own most productive citizens, and denie their own WOMEN education, health care, equal rights,etc.  

As far ad I,m concerned, Lets build a large fence around the entire MIDDLE EAST area and PAKISTAN/Afghanistan area and let them settle their own difference-----I don't like the idea of my descendancs paying for this insanity for the the next
Ray Manhattan is absolutely right...If Reagan had not armed the Talibans via Zia ul haq, Afghanistan would have been lot safer and secular. Half of those arms landed in Kashmir. So, there was violence there. Reagan supporedt OBL when his Saudi passport was revoked by the Saudis. Reagan's messenger, Rumsfiled shook hands with Saddam in 1984 after the monster had put chemicals on the Kurds few months earlier.

Remove the name of Ronald Regan from every monument in USA. Ronald Reagan caused 9/11. Reagan caused the most issues on this planet.
I request all interested parties on this subject read the the article of Irfan Husain "Why we are where we are" in DOWN newspaper internet version, dated April 25, 2009.

The fundamental problem that Pakisthan facing today, after 60 years of independance, is they do not know "who they are?"

It is sad that the sons of the most advanced ancient civilization of the world are now roaming the urban streets like angry animals and trying to destroy the human decency in the name of Islam, a great religion. The whole population are feeling they are helpless.

The great  ancient thoughts that were generated in the Indian subcontinent came mostly from the regions of India that is now Pakisthan. These enduring thoughts even today inspires the modern thinkers shows the world the path of love, acceptance and many other higher values. Long befor the birth of Budha, Jesus and Mohammad, their forefathers in Swat and other valleys of the country, realized these human potentials. The sprit of this culture and the brotherhood of Islam can create a human society that will be the cherised goal for any modern country.

My hope that Pakisthan's educated citizens will understand this opportunity. I urge them to come out of there comfortable elite life and take control of their country. Once this change happens, Pakisthan will be a shining star like China and India, and no one will be able to stop it.
I have always tended to the belief that the whole of that region is not worth one drop of American blood. If they wish to be ruled under some barbaric offshoot of Islam that is certainly their perogitive. If and when they pose a threat to this nation, then no one from any country ruled by Taliban Sharia should be allowed a visa to enter this country, directly or indirectly. If caught entering the US clandestinely, it should be assumed they are Islamic terrorists and they should be summarily dealt with.
 As for those who bemoan the loss of that regions oil, tough bananas. Not one drop of oil is worth one drop of American blood. Besides, what are they going to do with it, eat it? If those who attain leadership roles in that region become belligerants or a direct threat, we more than have th ability to bring much pain upon them from clean across the ocean. The question is whether we have the stomach for it. They are counting that we do not.
What, Ray, do you suppose the US should have done when the USSR invaded Afghanistan?  Do you think the US had no interest in the fight?  Please explain since you are so sure the United States is the cause of every ill.  And please also let us all know how you would have addressed the expansion of the USSR.  I hope you would have offered cookies with whatever solution you have.  Thanks in advance.
Quote From the story: “…the Taliban announced they would not lay down their arms and openly challenged the state. They declared that democracy was un-Islamic and called for harsh Islamic laws, known as sharia, to replace Pakistan’s constitution.”

Soooo- Agreements with INFIDELS (a.k.a. The Devil) are NON-Binding.  Imagine that!

And you cannot make any distinction in Islam between the religion, the culture, the law, the politics, the ideology or the government: in theory or in practice for one simple reason, Islam itself forbids it.  So any distinctions we might wish upon Islam are in fact MOOT, and actually quite silly on our part.  It is beyond me why nobody gets this.  Islam is totalitarian to the nth degree.
Ray:

No Western powers have ever defeated what are now collectively referred to as Afghans. The British attempted it on at least three occasions and got whipped.


Bob T:

Well, no.  The Brits then came back and took control again, for a long time.   Please check history instead of repeating errors of others.


Ray:

Remember it was the U.S. who armed Osama and others to fight the Russians


Bob T:

Not really.  We supplied people fighting in the north (mostly the Northern Alliance), while the Saudis aided those in the south, which included OBL's small group which fought poorly and were looked down upon by the Afghans.  I don't think OBL's small group had any of the Stinger missiles.  Read Lawrence Wright's "The Looming Tower".

Bob Tiernan


We can not vacate iraq and afghanistan, these ppl need us here and the pakistan army is doing their job with the tabilan, it takes stragety for them to plan everything out be4 they go after the tabilan, i am currently deployed and we are not leaving these countries until they can defend on their own no matter how long it takes.
Abject poverty, rampant corruption public and private, and ubiquitous malfeasance are amongst other challenges that continue to cripple Pakistan which has since independence (ca.1947) and subsequent declaration as Islamic Republic (ca.1956) failed to establish any meaningful stability in government.

Pakistan has the sixth largest population in the world (ca.172million) of which about 95% are Muslim. Pakistan is of high importance geo-politically for a
number of significant reasons. Consider the effect if the Russians had prevailed in Afghanistan; only a small push south though Pakistan would have availed for them direct access to the Arabian Sea. Pakistan has massive resources of natural gas crucial to serving domestic needs.

Some people claim that the national sport in Pakistan is game of cricket. Others say field hockey.
Rather than these, it is actually power politics playing in every level of society, from the local tribal rivalries where gun battles continue to erupt in endless tit-for-tat, up through the local and regional competitions to put the suits in Islamabad, to the plethora of 'political' parties all jousting and jiving not for purported leadership roles but rather for highest possible positions proximal to the trough which we Westerners like idiots continue to
refill to the tune of multiple billions of taxpayer  dollars every year without proper guidance, restrictions, audit, accountability, and consequence.

There is a dearth of any credible independent evidence this money is finding its way to proper use in building, repairing, or upgrading sorely needed infrastructure including electricity, water, solid and liquid waste, roads, communication, schools, education, healthcare, etc. contrary to what is reported in the rosy self-audits promoted by government aid bureaucracies such as CIDA from Canada. So where does all the money go?

It appears that what doesn't get spent on troops, hardware, and ammunition goes to the pants, families, and friends of the politicians and beauracrats holding the keys and proximal positions to the trough.  
Does this look like a long term solution to you?
Does anybody believe this is sustainable?
Does anybody believe this is the right thing to be doing?
Prolonging inevitable chaos demanded by the very nature of this Quran-mandated tribal culture?

Admittedly, it's easy to point fingers at flaws and criticize but what is the solution?

One might argue the best thing to do is remove the nukes and let them continue to duke it out amongst themselves as they have been wont to do for thousands of years.
On the other hand, one may well fear the heavy toll an unrestrained Islamist religious tyranny will exert on the helpless poor men, women, and children given the abuses abundantly demonstrated already by the so-called religious leaders. So it is pretty hard to turn one's back and just walk away aware of the evil perpetrated under the guise of Muslim power men that use the Quran to control society according to their wishes, traditions, and interpretations which are used among other things to condone honour killings and brutal torture and murder of women simply accused but not proven of adultery.

Now here we are in April 2009 after the Pakistani government agreed to allow Sharia law in the Swat region the Taliban have posted public notices ordering women not to go out of their homes. The posters warn that Taliban will "take action against women who go out shopping" and also threaten shopkeepers with severe punishment if they are caught serving women. According to tradition, wishes, and interpretation of the Quran, Islamists consider it obscene for women to leave their homes and venture out in public without a male relative (father, brother, or husband or son).

This is all very perplexing given the advanced ancienty society in which Pakistani predecessors have shown they can be brilliant builders. Just look at
the fascinating history of civil and structural design and engineering around 2600 - 1900 BC in the Mohenjo-daro cities created in the Indus Valley in
what is now Sindh province.
Yet today it seems the Pakistanis couldn't organize an emergency exit out of a burning paper bag if you opened it for them, so hobbled are they by greed, power politics, and corruption. And lack of altrustic vision, force, and effect on a broad collective level.

The dirt poor and uneducated are powerless to resist manipulation by Taliban. Qualified Western NGOs not government bureaucrats at the trough should be controlling the billions of dollars continually poured in from the West so that there is a quality assurance program to withstand the ubiquitous malfeasance which is as common as breathing
throughout Islamic Republic of Pakistan culture. Development in education, women's rights, and micro-economic as well as large-scale macro-economic and infrastructure development will help to effect the massive change in cultural norms that are required to bring Pakistan back from the precipice above the abyss into which it appears headed.

All modern democratic civil societies evolved through difficult times to where they are today. One  fundamental question appears to be if Pakistanis can
find the requisite collective will for change and find amongst themselves some altruistic national leaders rather than more crass opportunists in a long
line of same to replace those currently gorging at the trough.
The requiste social and cultural change is an inside job rather than one that can be
properly effect externally.

Pakistan must find the will and allow the West to guide and support them in the way as they have demonstrated repeated misguidance and failure on their own since 1947.  

It seems fair to say the scale and scope of the current and near-future challenges faced by Pakistan far exceed the wherewithall of Pakistan to cope,
despite the proud claims of Pakistani politicians to the contrary.
Pakistan needs the West needs to help, support, and hold it accountable for measures taken to prevent the country from falling into the abyss.

Youth and families in Pakistan need to perceive and participate in meaningful opportunities via education and economic development such that they can no longer be brainwashed, controlled, and manipulated by Islamists and perpetrators of deadly Sharia dictates instead of civil law provided for in the constitution of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan.
This is no small task. Given the tremendous extent of poverty and illiteracy, how likely is it a poor Muslim villager can stand up against a mysogynistic fanatical Islamist? Almost impossible. How could the peasant contradict the Imam, no matter how wacko the Imam, and survive? The whole village could and would likely realize the religious fanatic was not only misguided but evil yet the Islamist still holds the power in the village and uses references to the Quran and tradition along with his special brand of interpretation to beat the villager into submission or perhaps unconsciousness and death.

Firing bullets and dropping bombs are not long term solutions. We need to devise practical effective long-term solutions to combat fundamental diseases that need to be eradicated. Namely, anarchy fostered by fanatical Islam and arbitrary Sharia dictates, lack of civil law and independent judiciary, and rampant corruption which undermines the commercial and civil law and the independent judiciary as well as the spirit of the people and the fundamental tenets common to the original Jewish and Christian scriptures as well as the Quran which followed.  
A tactical retreat. The Taliban has now seen how easy it is to take over Pakistan. They will regroup and be back in a month to begin their push to take over the country.
India has to be thinking how it will respond. Pakistan under the Taliban (with nuke weapons) would no longer be Pakistan, so all bets would be off.
If we had any brains at all, we would form an alliance with India and drain this swamp once and for all. Yes, it would be awful. It will be much more awful in five years when Muslim fanatics have control of a massive nuclear arsenal.
I think we should round up Republican ultraconservatives, those who nearly ruined our economy and brought ignominy to the United States around the World, who lied and cheated the American people out of their pensions and jobs, and who tortured prisonars in our names. They can take with them most Fortune-500 CEOs & CFOs who are themselves accomplished criminals of the highest order and send them to the Swat Valley where they can compete well politically with the similar views of the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. Every member of Congress of the GOP stripe should go there too. They can be led there by the previous administration. Good ridance.
@ Ray in Kansas,Quote [ We are pushing the propaganda that if we are there the bad guys cannot do another 9/11.This propaganda is so stupid its almost beyond belief,but a substantial amount of Americans have been sucked in by it.]WOW right on,look at the bombing of the Washington subway,the bio attack on the wheat seed in the midwest,and the poisoned water in Seattle.But wait,that didn't happen.Nothings happened here !! But will we ever really know if our presence there keeps it quite here.Maybe these distructive wildfires,hmm.? I also would like to see our money spent on Americans,bring the aid & people home.
All I can say is we had better have a discussion with the Pakistani leadership who hold the keys to the nuclear arsenal. This discussion must include the plan of how and when to disable the arsenal quickly and permanently in the event of an imminent fall of the existing government.
Just as an aside to those who compare American religious zealots to the Taliban, you must be kidding! I don't agree with a lot of what American zealots say and do, but I certainly don't fear my life or liberty is threatened by them, do you?
im a british convert to islam, i have been a convert for for than 4 years and i have studied the religion in the best of detail, so i know what they are doing is not religion motivated is just because of there arogance, they are percieving what they are doing is part of there religion well im sorry to say well it isnt. Because ISLAM IS ABOUT PEACE. there just idiots what are making a bad name for the rest of us. well all i have to say is "if your cuzen has commited such a bad crime, it doesn't make the rest of your family criminals.
"Wait - hyperconservative religious fanatics attempt to impose their will on the population at large - you mean this is now considered a BAD thing by Americans?"

Give me a break.  One next wonders when the Hitler comparisons are going to be used.  Anyone who compares an American political party with members who are democratically elected to a band of un-democratic thugs who seek to impose Islamic law probably shouldn't be debating people with IQs over 60.
The only thing these people understand is violence, they use thier religion to justify what they do.  If the press would stay out of the business of the military, the war would be much different, possibly over.  The United States military is very capable of ending this at our discretion, but many Americans seem to have lost thier back bone, let the service men do thier jobs.  I am a true patriot and I believe in this country, but I am seriously concerned with how far removed from reality the population have become.  It is too bad that our countries demise may come at the hands of myspace, twitter, play station and mc donalds.  
If the Taliban does take over Pakistan, India is not going to sit around and wait as there nuclear capability extends only to neighbouring regions and are not ICBMs. Most of the Muslim world tolerate Christianity as it shares many of the prophets in the bible but not Hindiuism. This is apparent in most of the Arab countries where there is a lot of churches but Hindu temples are not tolerated. The taliban could gain an army in Pakistan whose majority is in poverty and shares the love for India (Sarcasm). India after China has the second largest Army in the world but would not want to comit to a war as it is a drain on resources as seen in the U.S.. Most likely in the event of a nuclear threat India would most certainly step in regardless of what the U.S. agenda is. China and Russia would also not want a U.S. military presence in Asia especially on its border. It would be safe to say that if Pakistan does not clean up its act, it will become another Gafur.
Dave in Chicago said - "Why is it that you say -he U.S. is to blame for the Taliban invaders now?!
Kinda twisted logic.."

This is a classic statement showing the total lack of knowledge in America today !
The USA has been meddling in the affairs of most every country in the world for over a hundred years, even now we have a MILITARY presents in 2/3 of the worlds countries.
What do think we would do if Israel placed troops, built bases and tried to influence the politics in the USA. ???

Our meddling has come back to haunt us and everyone seems to think the only solution is MORE MEDDLING !

WAKE UP !!!!

BTW; not even Hannibal could subdue that part of the world with force.

Religious fanatics of all kinds take advantage of ignorance to enforce their own rules. Even the Rev. Haiggie (not sure on the spelling) publicly stated he prays for Armageddon so that Jesus would return.

Lack of education and injustice will always lead to what was once called "freedom fighters" but now we call them terrorists !
Pakistan has nuclear capabilities; therefore, this situation should be a huge worry for everyone.
I agree with Ray in Kansas - a very astute and historically accurate summation and one that the powers that be in DC would have us forget.  Funny how no mention is ever made about how Osama came into power and was armed. Our Gov's compelling need to keep it's citizens in the dark and distracted by smoke and mirrors is quite disturbing. It's like every administration keeps the secrets and bad mistakes of the previous ones. President Obama it's time to shed the light on all the stupid things the CIA and previos administrations have done.  Let's get it all out in the open and take responcibility for our part in it and then vote on how we as a united country should proceed on these issues.  I bet the majority of Americans just want out of that region.  Pakistan is a different story - can't let religious zealots have access to NUKES!!!


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