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End of the road for German speedsters?

Posted: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 3:02 PM
Filed Under:

As long as I can remember, I have never had any of my overseas colleagues or friends make editorial inquiries about a regular party conference of Social Democrats party. But suddenly this week Germany’s internal politics touched an international nerve.

A proposed speed limit for Germany's super highway – the autobahn – was put on the political agenda at the Hamburg party Congress. Once the news hit the front pages of papers across Europe, it immediately triggered questions from many of my American colleagues

Apparently many had been day-dreaming about a high-speed journey in a powerful Porsche, whizzing past Cinderella-like castles, racing toward an ice-cold beer at one of Munich's famous beer halls – and they were afraid those dreams might be prematurely dashed.

Road rules reality
Unfortunately, I have to put an end to the myth of good times speeding along Germany’s roads unhindered by speed limits.

Germany is not the biggest race track in the world – speed limits have been in place for quite a while! Most stretches of the 7,600-mile highway network are marked with speed limits of 65 to 80 miles per hour. The regulations are often enforced by mobile radar traps – all too often leading to the painful fines arriving in mailboxes across the country.

And the very few roads in Germany that still allow you to press the gas pedal all the way through the floor are either congested with heavy traffic or supplemented by very narrow construction sites.

In the past car lovers from Great Britain have organized illegal races with ultra-powerful sports cars across central Europe. Guess where they were stopped by the police this year? Yes, in Germany!

Arguing environmental concerns
Germany's Social Democrats, junior partners in the grand coalition of Chancellor Angela Merkel, have argued the introduction of a speed limit would reduce both CO2 emissions and the accident rate.

In fact, statistics show that most of last year's accidents occurred on stretches with no speed limits.

But, while the SPD's own environmental experts argue that a speed limit of 80 mph could reduce CO2 emissions by 9 percent or more, other experts say that common traffic congestion and large combustion engines are just as harmful to the environment.

Merkel opposes the nationwide speed limit and says that Germany would be better off improving traffic circulation in order to reduce the amount of time cars spent in traffic jams.

The solution in this debate, which has been going on for years, may be simpler: Further introductions of even more environmentally friendly cars or just more train rides. (That is, if German train drivers don't go on strike again!)

And for visitors from foreign countries who are still seeking a high-speed adrenaline rush, the former formula one race track, the famous Nuerburgring, offers open roads on weekends for anybody who wants to catch the Indy 500 feeling in their own private – or rented – vehicle.

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Comments

Perhaps you should tell us more of the social democrart of Germany.
Yep, that's pretty accurate. While there remain stretches of the autobahn with no speed limit and there are still times when you will find little congestion, such areas are generally at most 'several' miles long. When you DO get the chance to crank it up to 120-130 MPH, you've covered the speed-limitless stretch in about 2-3 minutes and then are met by a speed limit once again.

After you do this about 3-4 times, you invariably get frustrated and slow it down to 80 just like everyone else.
There are plenty of places in the USA to get high speed thrills.  From Nascar style driving experiences to Ind(y) style experiences to driving your own street car on numerous tracks in the USA with organizations like SCCA and others.
Yes, I have been there and done that. Visited both Octoberfest (took the train to that one) and the Castles near the Austrian border. It is true that around Munich and other citys the traffic is bad. Then you see that circular sign meaning end of speed restrictions. It is far more than just flooring it. When driving you must keep right to allow faster traffic to pass. You can not pass on the right. I believe the DUI limit is .05. The German people put up with a lot to be allowed those few minutes of Freedom. I hope they keep it that way....
I don't understand why Americans think that there is no speed limit in Germany...I was just there a couple of months ago and have been to Germany many times in the past to see relatives and I have always seen limits on their Autobahns...and talk about BigBrother...there are traffic camera's in many areas waiting to "blitz" people for their traffic infractions, often times to the unsuspecting who'll return to their homes one day to find a hefty traffic bill in their Postkastens...Tschuess!!!
In nearby Netherlands, the speed limits (for the roads that I traveled) were regulated by overhead variable rate speed limits, changed on the basis of vehicle density and time of day.

Nevada or stretches of open highway in other locations in the American West are probably a better bet for "opening er up" (albeit illegally) than Europe at this point.
Great!  Now I won't feel so embarrassed when I cruise the Autobahn in my '99 Saturn.  I think it will do '88... just fast enough to initiate my flux capacitor.
As many people live in mainland Europe anymore, I couldn't really imagine doing the kind of illegal races the Brits were famous for organizing. Europe isn't exactly congested, but it's certainly got a lot more people - and thus a lot more parallel activity - than in  decade's past.
You can also participate in open road racing in Nevada (openroadracing.com). You have up to 130 miles you can run at top speeds, completely legal. It's approved by
the Nevada Department of Transportation (NDOT) and conducted on closed Nevada highways.
I don't think American believe all of Germany has no speed limits, but alot do think the entire autobahn does not.
There is a diffence between the government using "Big Brother" to enforce laws and government enacting laws to force people to protect themselves (like helmet and seatbelt laws, and 55 MPH)
I have definitely traveled faster in the US than anywhere in Germany. The unlimited stretches are marked with a little sign with a mark across it, easy to miss till everyone speeds up and you realize the limit has been lifted. Now you are not driving a powerful american car at $2.70 a galon that will go 140 mph or more, you have some underpowered junk box that might top 100 mph over there so what difference does it make? the open road might last 5 miles so all you do is waste $5 a gallon gas just to hit the brakes, plus a lot of the road can be twisty like the crappy old part of penn turnpike. France, especially the south has the finest roads, flat, perfect  and you can haul butt there. French women are amazing, they will tailgate you at 100 mph in bumper to bumper traffic outside paris, then blow by you - totally amazing!!! last year on cycle i came across desert on cycle, two up - 135 to 145 mph all day long, only problem is gas buddy, close to $5 a gallon and far and few between. Wanna really run? just hit the road to needles, ca - never saw a cop all day!! Forget europe except for their splendid drivers who pratice 9by law) get to the right!! (except the dutch in their volvo's who clog up the left lane).
I love the autobahn! I does have speed limits in some areas, although many places do not. They are the best highways I have ever driven on. Smooth,well designed and banked for speed. Always fun to drive on! Just respect the limits where they are and all ist fein.
Tschuss!
I worked in Germany, in Dresden, during 1999.
We traveled to and from Munich many times and could traver the 3 lane section with no speed limit from Munich to near Leipzig. This was at the limit of the Opal Vectra, 100 - 125 mph dependant on terrain, for hours. The limit on the two lane sections was 130 KPH or 83 MPH.
Clearly the impression you get depends on the part of Germany you are visiting.
As a country boy hailing from rural Montana, I experienced the fright of my life traveling at supersonic speed on the Autobahn between Hamburg and Kiel. The Mercedes chauffeur informed me that he could go still faster, but explained that after most accidents, they don't first call the paramedics, but instead the coroner. We went no faster that trip.
Sorry but I just can't see how slowing thing down is a sign of progress. Germany has once again failed the Fuhrer but it is always easier to follow than to lead.
Montana got rid of their no maximum speed limit on their interstate highways back in 1998.  Irresponsible actions by corporate America (domestic-foreign manufacturers, automotive magazine publishers, etc.) were using their highways as a test course for prototype and production vehicles, to test the particular vehicle's limits.  Needless to say the public and Montana Highway Patrol were not too happy.  MHP gave out plenty of tickets to those drivers.  Simply put, there is not Federal Interstate highway designed, engineered, or maintained for 100+ MPH speeds.  Race tracks are engineered for such speed and have a controlled environment.  You are guaranteed on a race track, you won't have stray livestock, hitchhikers, pedestrians, alcohol and or drug impaired drivers, disabled or abandoned vehicles in the roadway, etc.  The courts have consistently said driving on a public highway is a privilage, not a right.  To accomodate the desire of a few to drive and get a rush at high speeds on a public highway is reckless on the part of the driver and public officials.  Simply put, a public freeway is not a environmentally controlled race track.  I'm sure the atrocious death rate on the stretches of the German Autoban has got the attention of their citizens.  As a state trooper, I have driven 170+ ('72 Dodge Polara) to catch speeder.  All it takes is some individual to make a sudden lane change in front of you, and you probably bought the farm.  I had a flat once at 150 in Ford Mustang chasing a speeder.  That was a heart stopper to control in long sweeping curve.  Hopefully the German public will change take notice.  Go to some of the third world countries which have marginal or no traffic laws.  You'll realize why the U.S. has rediculous traffic laws.  The Middle East and the Latin American countries have the worst drivers in the world.
Interstates are an excellent place to explore high speed travel. I-95 and I-81 stand out in that regard. However proper equipment and road conditions are critical for travel in excess of 130 mph.
Avoiding rife toting rednecks in pickups may demand spurts up to 160 mph. Extreme stupidity is also required.
A 2000 Ford Escort ZX2 S/R will enable this mode of travel although be warned the fuel consumption will drop from the normal 34-36 mpg range to about 29 mpg.
There are plenty of stretches where you can drive consistently fast upwards of 150MPH. The e to his enjoyment is driving at night, where traffic is less congested. Take the stretch Braunschweig to Berlin with 170 miles of new three lanes in each direction. Further restricting speed is just another move to rstric freedom in the name of CO2 or safety or some other argument. As each year goes by, more and more laws are passed all in te name of something, but ultimtely leading to a more boring world.
Yeah, I lived in Montana in the '80's when there wasn't a speed limit, Just "reasonable and prudent." A great law gone bad after so many Californian's showed up and couldn't drive prudently. I enjoy the freedom to make my own choices as well as I'm sure a bunch of Germans do too. I wish them well with the Autobahn but the days of freedom are numbered by the control socialists. Next we'll be censored for voicing our opinion on things like this...
SIGHNS are only SIGHNS freedom is here in vermont USA  WE GREEN MOUNTAIN BOYS have no fear of SIGHNS I exprees myself almost daily with safe speeds over 100 mph. 1 of the boys
Itry to visit Germany every yer and there are still many stretches of road that you can open your vehicle up. I was able to drive over 140 MPH on one section. Most of the roads where you can still do this are in the former East Geramny where all the roads have been rebuilt from 1939 to current specifications and where there can be little traffic. There is a recommended speed limit country wide of 130KMH about 80 miles an hour. Driving in congested areas can be very trying but most of this congestion is caused by construction sites that are desparately trying to catch the West German Autobahn system up. By the time it is done 80 MPH will be comfortable.
I try to visit Germany every yer and there are still many stretches of road that you can open your vehicle up. I was able to drive over 140 MPH on one section. Most of the roads where you can still do this are in the former East Geramny where all the roads have been rebuilt from 1939 to current specifications and where there can be little traffic. There is a recommended speed limit country wide of 130 KMH about 80 miles an hour. Driving in congested areas can be very trying but most of this congestion is caused by construction sites that are desparately trying to catch the West German Autobahn system up. By the time it is done 80 MPH will be comfortable.
I have to disagree with the majority of you, including our esteemed blogger.  I lived in Germany until last year, and got to travel 150 MPH (240 kph), unfettered, every day.  It was frustrating on the days when traffic interceded, but that was not a constant.  Part of what made the traffic flow was classic German courtesy on the autobahns.  People only drove in the fast lane when passing.  This enabled roads with two lanes per direction to flow far faster and smoother than the eight and twelve lane highways we have in the States.  The joy of driving is why I will be moving back to Germany in the next couple years.  That and the beer, of course.  I am comforted by the fact that Germany has been having this debate about speed limits for as long as they've had autobahns, and it remains the most enjoyable way to travel in the world.
A driving school in southern Germany has done lots of business with young people who took advantage of their special offer.  "Learn to drive with us and we'll include high-speed trips on the Autobahn in one of our powerful cars."  Why?  "They are going to do this anyway, once they get their license;  they might as well learn to do it responsibly, under the guidance of an expert."  If the SPD has its way, this company will lose some of its special appeal.
As a German-American I felt foot amputated when I came to this Country. When I go back on Vacation to Germany I breath Freedom on the Autobahn. Freedom of Speed I mean.
But one gets used to the limitation on the Freeway here in our Country. Do not forget, most of my fellow American Citizen do not have a driving school and start driving with the tender age of 16. Let's change the freedoms we have. Give us Americans the freedom to drive without speedlimit and the Germans the freedom to bear arms. I think the population growth
will be stopped immediately (Just kidding) And please do not take everything so serious.
I'm sorry to hear that Germany has placed more and more restrictions on Autobahn speeds. We lived there for several years in the late 70's. (Part of the 55 MPH era in the US.) It was very nice to be able to run at 160Kph for an hour or so at a time. You could drive from one part of Germany to another in a day or less. (Border to Border)

I'm sorry to see that freedom restricted.
Since driving in the USA is a right, thanks to government and corporate collusion to make every city a car-centric city, I just drive as I like.

Sure, you gotta pay more in insurance and fines, but I've still got my license and I still drive when I like.

It's still (kinda) the land of the free.
To speed more then 70 miles an hour. Is the same as murder
Kirby,
that all depends on where you drive. Living there I did like at least once in a while to go as fast as the car could do- speed limits never stopped me from going fast when permitted. By the way, I never found a stretch of highway, where people went slow by choice..
If you ask me, the SPD-clowns are out of their mind to ask for a general speed limit
One of the best places to go wide open is on the A7 stretch from Kitzingen (Bavaria) to Ulm/Rothenburg. There is almost no traffic and the curves are long and sweeping causing very little reduction in speed. I made that trip many times in an American spec BMW M3 (with a few modifications of a chip, sport intake and sport exhaust). The normal trip takes about 30-45 minutes averaging 70-80 mph. I did it in 12:47 averaging 157 mph.

The other best place is on A81 which is between A3 and A6. There are lots of curves and hills which degrade speed but hardly any traffic. There is a tunnel about 10km from A6 that has speed cameras inside and outside just after the 120 kph speed limit sign.

Deutschland uber alles!!! (Nichts America)
howgreenmyvalley,
the social democrats or SPD for short are the german version of the Democratic Party here in the US.
the way people drive today is just outrageous! what is it worth risking your life and that of others just because of impatience?! i live in a small town and still feel like i'm in Houston, where you take your life in your hands if you drive less than 80mph, because they will just run you down or off the road...on a Road to Nowhere, folks!...what's the rush? it will be there when you get there, and you stand a better chance getting there if you take your time and drive safe...or, another way of putting it: GROW UP!!!!!
The Autobahn is practice for driving on the Ethniki Odos in Greece.

Oh yes, there are speed limits on the autobahn, after living almost 8 years in Kaiserslautern, I often had to pay tickets for speeding on the authobahn, not to mention the photo album collection I have.  
I have lived in Germany for the last two years with the Army and there are plenty of areas on the autobaun were there is no speed limit.  If you are only going 80 mph then there is someone on your tail flashing there lights for you to get over.  The only speed limits are through cities, towns, weather conditions and traffic (stau).  There is alot of road construction but not every 2-3 miles and the flow of traffic is very smooth.  I also have never seen any "illegal" street races by the English.  Oh and arn't the Social Democrates an offspring of the NASDP?
I lived there 8 years and there was always some sort of speed limit or recommended speed limit. The bottom line here is the Germans can do it because they treat driving like professionals with an expensive privelege. They are far better drivers than Americans who pale in comparison. I live in the Tampa area now. Drivers here lack common sense, patience and are generally inconsiderate and dangerous. They have no concept of safety and consider the roads their personal race. When it rains here which happens often your taking your life into your own hands at 55. I's go on but it just pisses me off every time I have to drive thru Tampa.
There are several differences not mentioned about driving in Germany and the U.S. One-there are signs (circle with the number 130 in it) which means it is the suggested speed limit. The faster you go the insurance liability goes down (insurance companies are not held responsible for your stupidity or recklessness). Another, their cars are built for that type of driving. I see too many "hicks" drive their 4 wheel drive pickups at 80mph with a look of consternation on their face because they have to go around you. Another, their drivers are better and better trained. The test a German takes has 150 questions 100 written and 50 road signs. They must answer 90 and 45 respectively. Not the 20 simpleton questions one gets in the states and have to pass 15. The biggest thing is that German drivers are predictable (they know how to handle a car and they know what their cars are able to do and not.  
In March  2001, I got to go see where my ancestors came from ! Driving on the Autobahn was very interesting ! There I was driving some kind of American import and every thing speeding by me had Mercedes Benz on it ?  Imagine large trucks with Mercedes Benz ?  As for for driving 110-120 mph, it was nerve-racking ! The Germans drive as safe and courteous as you can at 110-120 mph !  I do believe that some German drivers are very unhappy with the thought of a speed limit ?  There is a reason that you have heard the cliche,"speed kills".
Just test drive a Mercedes, BMW, Prosche, Audi or one of the high end VW like the the Passat W8 and feel the difference you will cruse 75mph and it feels like 20mph. Yeah they cost more but you more. I sure enjoy knowing that i have a safe and relible car at any speed even in the US.  
Living here in Pennsylvania, the worst fatality-inducer at excessive highway speeds is not other drivers nor the occasional state trooper, but rather the dreaded POTHOLE or poorly signed curve ahead.

Come up on either big one when doing 80 MPH+ and good luck to ya!
Too bad we can't change that old Law of Physics:
"It ain't the speed that will kill you - it's that sudden stop at the end!"

:)
Driving a car puts more than just your life on the line, even if you're a great driver there is always a chance at those speeds you'll hit someone else (or you'll freak someonee else out and they'll hit you).
To go fast is not always what it cracks up to be. When you make the wrong choice you get cracked and it does not feel good, I know. I have been in cars, semi-trucks, motorcycles driving way too fast. I missed alot that I couldn't see as I see now. I drive a Hyundai Elantra and at 62 - 65mph back and forth to work I get 35mpg. Traveling I get 45mpg. I soft pedal it. when I drove faster fuel mileage went down to 27. Most people are not racers and could not be on a race track so it is with high speed lanes in public. To go fast is sometimes thrilling, but if I have the need to speed, race tracks are the way to go. I was in Germany and I drove there too. My Uncle he took me for one of those drives "He said want to go faster?" "I said nope". Now I can drive slow and see the scenery. Lots of silent reminders to see.
thats comedy how the ex-cop deplores speed while bragging about how he went 170 to catch a speeder. why not let him go, moron?  ive always said, the difference between a cop and a crook is that the cop got his badge before he got arrested.
Were talking like speed limits are the end of the world. Who are we kidding anybody that buys a high powered car or truck for that matter did not buy id because he or she just wanted to talk about how fast it could be, they bought it because of how fast it is.Who among us has never tested the top end speed of our car or truck or scooter for that matter.i came through the muscle car era in the U.S. and at that time  every body i knew was hopping up something and the speed limits meant nothing to us. Well the people that were fast then are faster now because we can afford better faster and safer cars and trucks.And the speed limit signs still mean nothing (unless you know who shows up)The only thing is that some roads are safe at 176 mph(for a short spurt)and some roads are dangerous at 60mph it's you re common sense that govern what you do and where and when.It can kill you at either speed.
I think a speed limit will bring a lot of strikes in Germany! And there's not every 2 or 3 miles a speed limit. I'm from Germany, and live near Frankfurt with a lot of autobahn. There are no speed limits. But if you come near the city, there are speed limits, because of traffic (Stau). I drive every 3 month to Austria and there are parts, where you can drive as fast as you can.
But I think the costs of the drivers licence in Germany are so high, because of the Autobahn, the low age of legal alcohol consum and some other stuff. The price of a drivers licence is in Germany about $ 2000.
I hope we will keep the speed(limits) we have!


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