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Who's winning (in Afghanistan)?

Posted: Sunday, May 20, 2007 9:42 PM
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 No matter how many times I’ve visited the country, or been embedded with U.S. forces, or covered the lives of ordinary Afghans caught up in the almost 6-year-old war, I still cringe when asked – and I’m ALWAYS asked when I get back – ‘How’s things in Afghanistan?’’ Invariably I pause for a few seconds, hoping to find the magic answer as I collect my thoughts. But there is no silver bullet: ‘’Good,’’ I venture. ‘’And bad.’’

In fact, if you were to list – as I often do after each trip – both the encouraging and disturbing developments in Afghanistan, or what is better now than, say, a year ago, I suspect your columns would be pretty much like mine: equal. And that holds true on ANY scale. Take Kabul, for instance. On the plus side, business is booming. 5-star hotels, shopping malls, modern glassy trade centers, electronics stores and expensive foreign cars jam the streets. Also, former enemies now seem to be working together. At a recent reception for the Ahmad Shah Masood Foundation, held at the relatively luxurious Serena Hotel in central Kabul, the ‘beautiful’ people I saw tended to be former Mujihadeen generals and wily warlords. Those nice, smiling men sipping their black tea and chatting now were killing each other’s militias 10 years ago.

But, say critics, Kabul’s success is built on nothing but funny money: either from the billions of dollars in humanitarian assistance that never spread beyond the capital, or from war booty and drug money. And while there may be bubbles of peace here and there, overall, Kabul is too unsafe today for a foreign reporter to walk its streets without the kind of protection he would take into the streets of Baghdad. What about Afghanistan’s progressive president, former Baltimore restaurateur Hamid Karzai? We, in the West, tend to see him as a bastion of moderation, a leader who understands the value of bringing democracy to a nation that still lingers in a previous millennium. But many Afghans see Karzai as the failed leader of a failed state, rampant with corruption.


‘’This government and all of those in it are thinking only of themselves, ‘’ says one outspoken critic, Dr. Wadi Safi of Kabul University. ‘’They don’t know the nation, and they don’t think they are accountable to the people because nobody punishes them.’’

Now zoom out and take in the bigger picture…those U.S. forces – some 10,000 - that operate in the Eastern part of the country, along the border with Pakistan. They say that, by any measure of success, they are winning the war there. What WAS the Taliban’s backyard is now theirs. Local economies are thriving as U.S. commanders fund important infrastructure and health projects – a new road, a bridge, a school - that improve lives in areas where Americans dared not tread just a year ago. Local tips on insurgent activity and local cooperation are up; enemy attacks are down. It’s a counter-insurgency model that U.S. Centcom Commander Admiral William Fallon is keen to use elsewhere. He choppered into Kunar province during our embed to personally grasp that model and spoke to me of its merits in a rich green valley that, only months before, had been a hot zone for Taliban attacks.


‘’Frankly, we were focused on other places, like Iraq, but now we’re back in it,’’ he said. ‘’I see Afghans who welcome us and want to work with us, and I think this is exactly what we want to do.’’ And, in the southern provinces, after a 4-year power vacuum,  a 35,000-strong NATO force is now fighting ITS war against the Taliban. And it’s made huge gains since the spring, decimating whole companies of militants who dare go toe-to-toe with the U.S.-led troops. Just days before our embed ended, there was news that the Taliban’s most dreaded – and efficient – commander, Mullah Dadullah, had been killed in an intelligence-driven attack by U.S. and Afghan forces in the volatile Helmand province.

But all of this GOOD military news has a political flip side. U.S. forces may be winning the war, but not necessarily the people needed to sustain that battle. In many Afghan provinces, locals tend to mistrust their own government representatives even more than U.S. forces.  But that equation is getting WORSE: as U.S. and NATO forces step up their attacks – including devastating air strikes – against Taliban fighters, hundreds of civilians have been killed in the crossfire as well. Now Afghans are DOUBLY angry: they see President Karzai as both ineffective AND too pro-U.S.


‘’Certainly militarily we are winning the war, ‘’ says Afghanistan expert Dr Barnett Rubin. ‘’The question is whether we are building a political base, and that is very much in question…because the Afghan government is increasingly unpopular.’’

So, how IS it going in Afghanistan? Are we winning or losing the war? Or the peace?  I see no pat answer. No 10-second sound bite. We are winning some hearts, but losing other minds. We are bringing a sense of peace to parts of the country where we have soldiers at least, but the Taliban is still intimidating whole towns, elsewhere, with death threats posted on residential doors at night, with school burnings, ambushes and roadside bombs. We have defeated Taliban and al-Qaida militants in dozens upon dozens of battles this year, but their suicide bombers keep on coming – and exploding – from inside the Pakistan border, where they are trained and equipped.

Some have called this ‘reaching a tipping point’. Perhaps that’s the best answer: Afghanistan IS balanced between good and bad, war and peace, winning and losing. Some days, in some ways, look very positive indeed. But winning in Afghanistan still appears no better than a 50-50 bet. It could go either way. There are still too many reasons why Afghans could see a low-burn guerilla war that kills thousands of civilians – as well as several hundred American and allied soldiers - every year…for years to come.


Jim Maceda is an NBC News correspondent is based in London who has just returned from an extended assignment in Afghanistan.

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I like this article because it's not yea-rah, mission accomplished, B.S. fluff; it's balanced and honest. One of the points is: "success" is not black and white and that comes across well. As an "average joe" American, whenever I read/hear updates about Afghanistan, I can't help but wonder if (1) our CIA controls the opium drug trade like it did/does(?) for the cocaine from columbia; and (2) if it's not obvious that we're doing good, shouldn't we get out? And NATO too? Good article, Jimmy.
The quote by Dr. Wadi Safi, i.e., "This government and all of those in it are thinking only of themselves" seems to equally apply to OUR U.S. government, doesn't it? 80% of "the people" against the war in Iraq, and yet we're still there? Thank you very much Military-Industrial-Complex thugs.
it breaks my heart when i read that the "humanitarian" assistance only goes to the former warlords and the government officials. it should be used to get the peasant goat herders satellite internet, which in this day in age, equates to education.
this country can't even protect our own borders or figure out a way to educate the inner-city blacks in new orleans. i say we get the heck outta there till we can take care of our own.
Dear Mr.Maceda, I honestly would not know how to answer how it was going in Afghanistan because it all seems full of violence and innocent people being the victims. In the posting it states that Kabul is booming in business with hotels,shopping,trade centers and expensive cars. Yet in some parts of Kabul a reporter would need the same protection to walk the streets as when in Baghdad because it is too unsafe. That seems just incredible that a city can project entirely different images in just one region. I'm sure it must be hard for the people to trust their own government and that makes it more difficult for our troops to work with the people of the region. There is never going to be a way to win or lose this battle. If the troops bring peace to one area then the Taliban and al-Qaida cause death and destruction on another. Maybe if peace is accomplished in a particular part of the region and these groups don't destroy it, then progress is being made. I suppose that in Afghanistan there are good days and bad days. Hopfully someday the good days will outweigh the bad. There might never really be a clear winner of this conflict with regards to any army of men. But I think the only true winning philosophy will be peace. Please stay safe all who report from the Middle East. Peace to all!!
When invaders still bomb a country 9000 miles away after nearly 6 years, it is clear this is a western colonial bombing war on a dirt-poor Muslim country in a resource-rich area of the world. The Afghan resistance, always demonized with the term 'Taliban', will increase as they have hated and fought foreign invaders for thousands of years. The people's hearts and minds, and time and resources are not on the side of the invaders. As the Russians, they will bleed and bleed and bleed. And in the end they cannot sustain it, they cannot sustain a 'trickle' at a time, a few deaths each day, a few million dollars a day, for too many years to come. The illegal attack and occupation of the country and the continued bombing war on Afghans is all wrong, as the invasion by the Russians was wrong. This asymmetric bombing warfare is all wrong and in the end it will produce many more trained resistance fighters as well as suicide bombers. A failed policy, a failed war, and justifyably so - to stop those western invaders of trying it again on some other dirt-poor defenseless country ten thousand miles away from our shores.
Mr. Maceda: You say that Afghan civilians are mad about the U.S. presence and are angry at Hamid Karzai and their government. But, if they are mad at the US military for fighting the Taliban are they also mad at the Taliban for putting civilians in harm's way? If they are mad at the government for being too pro-USA don't they recall that USA is the reason why there's a democratic government at all? I wish you could provide some ideas, suggestions and solutions. What should happen? Should we stay indefinitely? Should we leave?
They don't value human life anyways. Killing, for them is just a past time or a way to go to the paradise that they have been promised. Pity.
They don't trust their corrupt government? Who'd a thought it was true? They are modeled after our government and we don't even trust our politicians.
LET'S SEE the British lost twice in Afghanistan..the USSR also and with more than twice as many troops as NATO and the US...also I believe the pro Soviet Afghan army was much larger than the pro-western (??) one there today..currently at best its a stalemate but does the WEST have the political will to stay and fight????...based on post WWII history I would say no
Jim, Afghanistan has suffered war since 1979. To say the current conflict is only 6 years old is an understatement. The best way I can understand it is to immagine the effects of hurricane Katrina on this country for 28 years. WW II did not last that long and the US is STILL in Japan and Germany. Who honestly thought we could come here and make everything perfect in just 5 years? CPT Hirte USA, IN
I currently live in Kabul as an INGO worker and this is one of the most reasonable, clearly written opinion pieces I read in the three years I've been here. No hyperbole or left-wing/right-wing rhetoric. The point is: the vast majority of Afghan people are glad we are here and are grateful. But moving a country from a non-literate, agrarian-based, middle-age society to a post-modern, information age society without the benefits of moving through culture events like an industrial revolution or a Renaissance period is going to take a Herculean effort. To simply drop “democracy” out of a plane and then flying away is in the least naïve if not at worst a disaster waiting to happen. This will be a twenty year process…minimum.
"We are winning some hearts, but losing other minds." let me define "some" and "other". you are winning the heart of warlord, druglords and CIA's Afgan couterparts. and you are losing the mind of Afghan nation.
Jim Maceda's thoughtful piece does much to present a balanced picture of the situation. Yet, it is true that this situation cannot continue forever. There has to be an 'exit strategy' for Afghanistan. A date should be set - even one two years from now - and all forces should leave whatever the situation. The British did it in India and despite a bloodbath, the country survived.
Thanks Jim, this is a good new report.
It is common knowledge that the cost of the invasions and occupations in both Iraq and Afghanistan is in the $100's of billions of dollars. The clear winners are the arms and logistic suppliers who are on the receiving end of the tax payers’ largesse. Obviously this business far outweighs the profits to be gained from oil exploitation, however, this constituency must also benefit.
Sir, You say that "U.S. forces...that operate in the Eastern part of the country...are winning the war there. What WAS the Taliban’s backyard is now theirs." How is it going in Khowst, specifically? I spent some time at FOB Salerno, and the only news I get is when something bad happens. The Afghans I worked with were very positive and forward-looking, but that was 2004-5, so I'm wondering how they are doing now.
let me get this straight. now the media is saying that we are losing the battle in Afghanistan too? what's next, are you going to say that we should admit that we nade a terrible mistake going there in the first place? Please stop.
The shortcoming of American foreign policy has always been its inclination to seek a simplistic view, with a defined beginning, middle and end. While it is possible that the Islamofascist movement in the region, whose tentacles spread to us on 9/11, will burn itself out someday, that may take generations. We have to face the hard reality that we will lose a thousand soldiers a year, or more, as well as many billions in our treasure, to keep the lid on this movement. And we will have to fight these guys, much more intelligently than we have, for decades. Or we'll lose. There are no magic bullets- we found that out by invading Iraq.
War is tough. Occupation is tough. It may not have worked in Iraq but it worked in Germany, Italy, Japan, Bosnia and Kosovo. It may eventually work in Afghanistan too-- but not if our media locks in on the negative and methodically tears apart every success. The 1960's generation was good at highlighting the flaws of the WW II generation-- but the 60s generation has flaws too-- one is the inability to support ANY WAR, ANY WERE, for ANY REASON. That is a serious flaw because some wars are neccessary. Worse, still, the 60s generation (who are now management in 4 out of 5 major televised media outlets) are expert at tearing down United States military actions-- magnifying the failures that are the part of any war effort-- until that effort disintigrates. The truth is the 60s generation, which brought many good things-- gay rights, environmentalism, womensrights ect-- also wants us to fail in amy military effort-- because many from that generation find these failures to be self validating. Sadly, we have to succeed in Afghanistan-- not only do 25 million Afghans need it-- but 300 million Americans do too. The 60's generation was a great generation-- but it will also be great when most of them retire.
Your opinions are not completely right.Because it is just on your side,as an American citizen.It would better if your put you on the part of an Afghan citizen.Right?
you are right its 50-50 bet, but what is the status of common people of Afghanistan? sure they will never win. you cant find the solution of Afghanistan in building 5 star hotels in Kabul. a strong kabul is not of the use of poor people living far from kabul who have nothing to eat. Local Government, the Govt. of the pople. let the Democracy come. hold fair elections in each area whoever win even a talban commander give him rule of that area and provide him funds for development. pull all your forces from his area. Dont interfare as he is elected by the local people. let him do until next elections. Give the common people what they want.
Thats an easy one. Nobody is "winning".
The only reason that the majority of the American population is against the war is that they have been given incorrect, biased and very incomplete information concerning it from the news media. They do not understand the determination of the terrorists to kill all of us. We either fight and kill them over there, or they kill our people here. Anyone who doesn't understand that is naive, uninformed and will see that the cost will be too much to bear. 9/11 will repeat itself over and over and the press will continue to encourage Americans to forget and turn the other cheek. Thank God there are plenty of Americans who see this and are willing to protect those who live in a fantasy world. Thanks for you excellent, unbiased article.
The wars in the middle east have been going on over religion for numerous years, prior to Bushs' invasion, and they will continue to go on wether our troops are there or not. We need to get out and let them try to live with each other. We have enough of our own problems that the troops can help out with here. Border patrol, help in New Orleans, and the hurricane season is just beginning. Only God knows what other disasters will happen this year. I support the troops, I myself was in the Air Force, I just don't support Bush..
6 years, thousands of lives, and billions of dollars later the only thing we can say about Afghanistan is: "Well it could go this way, it could go that way." The poor are still poor and they still eat grass to survive. Other than rugs and poppies, the Afghanis don't produce anything people want. The country is a dump. Where there are dumps there are rats. All we've succeeded in doing is force the rats to hide. The only guarantee for Afghanistan's future is that once we leave (and we will), the rats will return. Business 101 - if there's no foreseeable ROI, cut your losses and move on.
Dear All, I have been living in Afghanistan for the past 6 years. As an Afghan-American I fully support the US government for comming to Afghanistan's aid. But there seems to be several problems with the way we are operating. 1) If you are going to be the savior then you need to act like it, by helping the people of that country when you know that countries government s corrupted. Lets face it mostly all 3rd world courntries are full of corrupted government officials, and we can start from the top of the list like President Karzai's brother who everyone is claiming that he is the biggest drug dealer in all of Afghanistan whose car was full of drugs when it was stopped. The former Minister of Forign Affairs, this guy had no qualifications to be in that seat, but he was friends with Karzai and got the job. The Distric of Attorney in Afghanistan, should I even mention him, he has thrown thousands of people inside Afghan jails for no apparent reason. We vistited some of the jails and were shocked to find out the percentage of people being found not guilty when send to court (after they were in jail for many months). And we are claiming that we have brought Democracy! Last time I checked you were suppose to be innocent till proven gulity and not the other way around. Next on the list is the Minister of Communication, this guy is getting bribes left and right and has given a contract to his In-Law's family. Last thing regarding these corrupted government officials is that Most Of Them Can Not Even Read! They have their aid write a command for whatever problem you have and since they can not read they will just sign it. So its pretty much save to say that we are losing the battle in Afghanistan, when we still have warlords as Ministers or other types of government officials and are using their powers to fill up their own pockets. Now the people are mad at the US government because they are the ones incharge of Karzai and they are the ones that can control Karzai. Since they are not doing anything, well then people are blaming the US and Karzai for the problems in Afghanistan.
I just read not only your blog but most of the responses. If it is a 50, 50 situation then I have got to believe that is better than what it was before. I am not saying we have won, but I must feel that we are winning. One of the responses states that "they don't value human life" where is the value for human life in America? I live in Philadelphia were there have been over 150 peopled murdered, is that value of human life. We are only one city there are murders all day long in our great Country.
OH Goody, Now that the press has decided to make sure we are well on our way to losing in IRAQ we going to try to see if we can screw up the home front in Afghanistan too.... Hell next lets go back and re-examine WWII so we can figure out how we lost that war too. Back then the press realized they had a part in trying to win the war... I wish now adays you'd all just settle for doing nothing rather than trying to make us lose!!!!
It's NOT who is wining in Afghanistan... but what? "It's The Poppy, stupid." Although, for a nice little drug war... one could look a little more closely to home. Say, 20 miles South of the Az border. The problem with Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan is that "They" couldn't WALK here. The Mexican drug lords can, and have. Now, with NAFTA they will be able to drive their trucks, quite freely, right up to the front door of your childrens schools. Have a nice day.
people ask us to come help till we get there....let's let them solve their own problems.The money we have spent could have took care of our problems here in the ole U.S.A. Our elderly prescriptions that they can't afford to buy, our borders, more law officers, and mainly to get rid of the pick pockets in Washington in both parties and houses.
I appreciate a well thought out report of what is going on in Afghanistan and Iraq. Being a Vietnam War veteran I understand how lack of support on the homefront can nulify the best efforts of dedicated soldiers and civilian nation builders. We need to continue our mission to rebuild Afghanistan while at the same time helping the Afghan Army in its battles against the Taliban and other anti-government insurgents.
There is no doubt that these areas(Afghanistan/Iraq) of unrest are slowly deterioriating under their present conditions but isn't it possible that the stories and wording used every day to describe their daily conditions are a bit propagandanistic? Our press covering the stories calls the "situations"->The War in...yet there are few exchanges of artillery,fewer air strikes and the "Scorched Earth tactics" used so many times before in theatres of battle are next to zero now.There are no defined lines of engagement,the enemy uses terrorism instead of military tactics to wage it's "war machine" and our press is so biased in it's story telling these days that it's almost like the news coming from inside of Russia prior to the end of the cold war.The present situations could hardly be called wars.The very definition of war has not been seen in both areas in over 4 years.I have friends in the special forces both in Iraq and Afghanistan and the stories they are telling me I've rarely heard on the nightly news or read in the major papers. Why won't our press give us a unbiased measure of what is actually happening,drop the opinion telling and finally tell it like it is?Is telling half truths and biased story telling really covered by the protections in our Constitution for freedom of the press...I think not!!
what really bothers me about this whole war thing in afghafnistan, is the fact that how a nation as strong as we are, how we have forgoten. The Russians couldn't do it with all their weapontry. it's HOLY.. what we are diong is loseing American lives. it's not our war. bring our men and women home now.
The US knew very well it was getting into because the US was supporting Bin Laden and the Mohjardin to fight the Russians in Afghan. What goes around comes around but the military industrial complex is just fine what all the military action going on all over the middle east, The US economy needs military conflicts to keep the its economy afloat..
It is a shame that MSNBC spent all that money and time for you to come up with an article that could have been written from New York. We're not winning, but we're not losing. It's both good and bad. People's lives have improved and not improved. Come on. Put some additional perspective into your writing. How is Afghanistan now compared with Afghanistan seven, 17, or 27 years ago? That would take some investigation and real journalism, and more than just a week out in the countryside away from that 5-star hotel in Kabul if indeed you actually spent any significant time away from Kabul. Is that too much to expect from MSNBC? Other comments gush over how this isn't a puff piece. How wrong they are.
one nuke would end the problems we face there iraq and iran next we got the fire power lets use it
Nice job reporting. To the person that thinks this is a resource rich area, you are wrong, they are poor and do not have much going for them, thats why the drug trade is so hard to get rid of. I will pray for them.
U.S. will win..they are fighting a medieval army..but 9/11 evidence points to white house as mastermind, so this war inAfghanistan is an illegal war!
It's time to come home we can't win over their. It's like v.n all over again
No body said war is easy... It costs money, lives and pain. This goes for everyone in Afghanistan and Iraq. US wants to put democracy in the streets of Bagdad and Kabul but can not seem to get the samething in the streets of New york and New orleans. Why should Afghans trust US to bring peace to them. Were they able to bring peace in Vietnam and Iraq? No Body wants the US money more than the war lords who have to sustain the armies that will be used as soon as US goes out of Afghanistan.
The Taliban used Afghanistan as a base in which to harbor, train and export terrorism. They destroyed the fledgling government that had struggled since the Soviet Union withdrew. The people suffered under a brutal, unmoving, tyrannical governement under the Taliban. Nations are not made in days, weeks, months, or in a few years. You of the "fast-food" mentality, who want it fresh, hot, and now are deluded. Spend a year in a country like Iraq, as I have and tell me that the Americans there are evil. I saw no evil and those who did commit acts contrary to American efforts were punished. The efforts are genuine in their determination to make the region a better place than the despots who ruled them left them. What is the status of Afghanistan? It exists, with the hope of a better future, what more can any country truely have?
We went there to get Osama; so far nothing, furthermore the better part of the American Army was sent to Iraq instead. Somebody in power should have said: "let's get this son of a bitch and then let's get the fuck out of there." But no, this is now a fine mess we got into.
People, get a grip. This is the report of a reporter that really knows no more than you and I. Unbiased? I think not. Credible? Doubtful. Don't take my work. Actually talk to the men and women there and you see an entirely different picture. Are there issues remaining? Absolutely? Have we made mistakes along the way? Sure... what ware haven't there been mistakes made? Should we be in both Afghanistan and Iraq and continue working toward defeating terrorists. ABSOLUTELY? This isn't easy. It isn't going to get over quickly. And we spoiled people need to back off and let the military do its job. As the proud parent of a marine who very much believes in this mission, I despise the way the media depicts what's going on. Think about it... how many "positive" stories have you really read? You'd think by the news all was lost... and then you have idiots like Sen. Harry Reid saying we've lost. You owe it to yourself, and to the men and women of the armed services to get the real storie.
People, get a grip. This is the report of a reporter that really knows no more than you and I. Unbiased? I think not. Credible? Doubtful. Don't take my work. Actually talk to the men and women there and you see an entirely different picture. Are there issues remaining? Absolutely? Have we made mistakes along the way? Sure... what ware haven't there been mistakes made? Should we be in both Afghanistan and Iraq and continue working toward defeating terrorists. ABSOLUTELY? This isn't easy. It isn't going to get over quickly. And we spoiled people need to back off and let the military do its job. As the proud parent of a marine who very much believes in this mission, I despise the way the media depicts what's going on. Think about it... how many "positive" stories have you really read? You'd think by the news all was lost... and then you have idiots like Sen. Harry Reid saying we've lost. You owe it to yourself, and to the men and women of the armed services to get the real storie.
"...their suicide bombers keep on coming – and exploding – from inside the Pakistan border, where they are trained and equipped..." Can nobody understand the depth of feeling from Pakistan after 'Union Carbide' killed and maimed thousands of Pakistanis in the Bhopal explosion? The Americans offered a mere $10 in compensation to some families. Americans treated the locals like they are rats, and not one American was brought to book for negligence. The USA reaps what it has sown?
We went there to get Osama; so far nothing, furthermore the better part of the American Army was sent to Iraq instead. Somebody in power should have said: "let's get this son of a bitch and then let's get the fuck out of there." But no, this is now a fine mess we got into.
We will never win. Bottom line we either have to treat this as a war or pull out stop the pussy footing around. War is hell, lives are lost families are wrecked infrastructure is destroyed. War should only be used when all diplomatic means have failed. Iraq Was a mistake, Afghanistan we had no chance we did not have relations at all. The so call war on terror will not be won with 9000 troops in Kabul. Sadly the fact is terror must be hunted throughout the world. Somilia, Sudan, Iran, to name a few and terrorist and their supporters ie the money men must be hunted down and treated like the dogs they are. No trials no prisons just body bags. No rebuilding just down right death and destruction to the supporters of terrorist and slave traders. Our job is not to rebuild countries.
The comments are more interesting than the article. We are now a country of wieners. We are a country that wants instant gratification, if the job can not be completed in 6 months - pull out! It's a good thing that this generation wasn't around during WWII, I seriously doubt that we would have won. D-day alone we lost over 5,000 men in one day!!
Its not about locking on the negative, its not about bringing democracy, its about a basic failiure to understand the mindset of those whose homes are being blasted away every day. The Afghan nation is one held in a time bubble 200 years old. What you DONT need to do is bring in something that has taken that long to establish i.e democracy into a land which is UNCAPABLE of understanding even the basic concept of it. What they DIDNT need was more money, where those in power have no intention of letting it get into the hands of the deserving. It is still a feudal landscape. Consider some otherworldly power giving the French Arisocrats that much money during the revolution. There wouldnt have been one! Feudalism kills itself. And that takes time. THe biggest mistake the U.S is carrying on and on in the world is to not understand that need for time. Most of the third world is a hundred years behind the States. American Foreign Policy, by demanding so much of a world not equipped to stand at par with it, is throwing every cog, wheel and gyro that the natural mass psychology of humans has caused to function of the past how ever many millenia. Im ranting, and will continue to do so lest i say goodbye.


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