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'Death to America' and a cup of Starcups!

Posted: Saturday, March 17, 2007 12:40 PM
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"Death to America!"

Tens of thousands of fists punched the air as the chant reverberated around the vast tent-like mosque at Tehran University.

 

For 28 years the religious and revolutionary faithful have packed in here for Friday prayers, listening to hard-line clerics heap scorn on the United States, chanting on cue. 

 

Aware of the power of this image, the authorities have built a stage for television cameras, where we were invited to set up our tripod – a sea of faces below, and to our left the podium from where the cleric whipped up the crowd. A mild-mannered guide was on hand, explaining the order of play, and pointing out the dignitaries sitting near the front.

 

VIDEO: Fridays in Tehran mean more than just 'Death to America' chants. NBC News' Ian Williams reports. 

 

Another chant. “Death to America?” I inquired. “No,” the guide replied with the sweetest of smiles, “that was ‘Death to England.’” Clearly the presiding cleric had opted for a bit of variety in his performance this week in what must be one of the most enduring slogans of the Islamic Republic. 

 

But is it a particularly accurate reflection of the way ordinary Iranians think?

Leaving the university behind, we set out across Tehran to see how others were spending their Friday, their day of leisure, and what they thought of America. We passed the blood-curdling murals on the walls of the “Den of Spies,” the former U.S. Embassy – including a skull painted on the face of a statue of liberty. Veiled women waited for a bus nearby, while a group of teenagers languidly tossed a basketball close to the wall.

 

A cup of 'Starcups'
Then we arrived in the downtown shopping district. For the crowds packing the malls and bazaars, Friday is a day for bargain hunting, especially with the Persian New Year a few days away. A table near the entrance of one mall was stacked high with DVD copies of Hollywood movies – illegal, but openly sold.

 

In another mall we stopped at “Starcups,” where they call the coffee American, and where the most politically charged conversation was about who won the Oscars.

 

“Of course we know who all the actors are. Their pictures are in people’s homes,” said Amir, sipping coffee with a group of young friends. The women wore their headscarves well back on their heads, colored hair spilling out in the front – a fashion that can still invite harassment from the moral police.

 

Shops carried signs for Levis and Nike. Baseball caps were for sale, “NYC,” "LA," the New York Yankees, Budweiser, and the Statue of Liberty were among the logos emblazoned on the front.

 

Outside the mall, an older man, also called Amir, came across and introduced himself. He was from Shiraz, and visiting his family. What was his idea of America, I asked. “I think the people of America are very nice,” he said. “Really.” Then he added, almost apologetically: “But the government is not so good with our government.”

 

More than two–thirds of Iranians are under 30, most born after the revolution. They get their information online, or from the illicit satellite dishes sprouting on Tehran’s rooftops.

 

Avoiding the moral police
For them Friday is a day to head to the hills of north Tehran, where modest public displays of affection attract less attention from the moral police. The hillside here is dotted with colorful restaurants and stalls, laden with sizzling kebabs and sacks of nuts and dates. Water rushes down deep gullies from the melting snow above.

 

We met one young couple, Maryam and Mohsen, who like many couples up here walk hand in hand, something that would be more risky in the austere streets below.

 

Inside a restaurant, Maryam told us: “America has some good things. It’s not like we are told on the TV. They have a good people and a good culture.”

 

Her boyfriend cautiously agreed. “American people live well,” he said. “They have good industry and good education. Unfortunately America wants to solve its disputes with Iran in a strong-handed way, and sometimes that makes it harder to see the good side.”

 

It’s not really scientific, but spending a Friday traveling around Tehran (and braving the diabolical traffic) does leave the impression that the mullahs are somewhat out of touch. 

 

In fact the people of Iran, with one of the region’s most anti-American governments, are probably better disposed toward the United States than in other countries in this region that call themselves allies of Washington.

 

Yes, there are concerns about U.S. policy – and a military attack on Iran would likely rally support behind the mullahs. As one young man said, "I don't like the government, but if Iran were attacked I'd defend my country."

 

But for most people we met in Tehran there are better ways of spending a Friday than crowding into the university mosque to cry “Death to America.”

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Comments

Thank you for showing the other side of Iran. It's nice to know that the whole country doesn't want "death to America." I gets a bit depressing constantly hearing that the world hates us.
And yet, these are the same people who elected their government. Just as the rest of the world holds all Americans responsible for their government's actions, so are the Iranian people viewed as allowing their mullahs and government officials to speak for them. It's about time the public in ALL countries took a more active role in the public face their governments present and refute the official policies they endorse with their silence.
Death to Iran
the people of iran are just like us they want freedom but cant have it because of religon hopefully we wont have to bomb thier country but i think its gonna happen
That's fascinating! It's hard to reconcile those two images -- but great to know. It gives me hope.
An old sage once told me, "When you hear two opposing views of the same event; you can bet one of them is a lie." This story tells me that either the governments of the United States and Iran are lying to us or the news media is lying to us. The truth, he also said, is probably somewhere in between the two views. I can only pray that we acheive the truth of the story of Iran vs. the USA before the lies create a war...a real war.
Thank you so much for posting this. I feel that with all of the media coverage about the war people tend to just lump Iran in with Iraq. It is SO great to read what real, average people think about America. I would love to see more reporting like this. Until we can get past the idea that all middle easterners are terrorists who hate America, we will never be at peace. They're real people just like us and are capable of seeing both sides of the coin, just as we Americans could be if we weren't so blindly predjudiced.
This article confirms what I now believe to be the truth that even our governmant won't tell. The fact is that our government, and our media, portray countries like Iran to be one of total and complete hatred toward America. The propaganda is the same from both governments. I think that time will change the cultural climate in Iran and America ought to find ways to help that along and not resort to taking countries by force.
Good article. It's almost hope inspiring, that the people of Iran when asked their opinion on America, it's a relatively good one. I personally like that people can separate their dislike for our government, and their fondness of our culture. It's important, governments change, every 4 or 8 years, but our culture will remain the same, more or less. More reporting like this can change our opinions, a little understanding, can bring a little peace.
I'm sure that not everyone in Iran chants "Death to America!" However, what indication do we have that the people interviewed out on the street weren't giving a subdued opinion since they knew they were speaking to an American reporter?
Jack Sheeder, you have it wrong. It shouldn't be "Death to Iran," it should be "Death to Iranian Leaders," and even then, only the hardliners. We've got bozos in our government, too. I have met Iranian people and they have been very nice!
better watch out IAN your zionist boss will fire you if you keep on reporting like this
If anyone ever takes the time to view photos of Iran and it's people, one would see a beautiful country. And it hurts me to see the faces of young Iranian children who have the same dreams as our children here in the USA. The governments of both countries are the ones destroying any lasting harmony among it's people. I myself a longtime Republican have finally opened my eyes and came to the opinion that war is not the answer. Nor is the threat of war. Our government and it's administration has opened up a hornets nest in the past few years and I see no way of putting that nest back together. It is a shame that the civilians of both countries have to now suffer the consequences for years to come. God have mercey on both the Iranian government and the Bush Administration.
As an American who lives part-time in the Muslim world. It is refreshing to see that there is another side of the story that the media doesn't cover. The side that shows how much the ordinary people of the Islamic world want peace as much as we do. Since moving abroad 2 years ago, I have never once in my travels to Morocco (an Islamic Country) been subjected to racism, natinalism or anti-Americanism. If fact it has been quite the opposite. That isn't to say that these feelings do not exist in certain parts of the world...but our media needs to show both sides of the coin. The politics of fear and hatred has ruled for far too long. It's time to sit down at the table and discuss our mutual interest....PEACE.
american popular culture wills save the world, for it's become a lingua franca. it upholds the value of the personal life, and it wasn't imposed from the top down, so it was off the radar of most pundits, especially those on the left.
It's no suprise that Irananians and Americans can live in peace and love for one another; however, what does shock me is that reporting like this does not make it to the front pages the way hatred, rage, and violence does. May we all be enlightened, and blessed; by Allah, and God.
Americans? Predjudiced!? No, really?! They are too busy talking on their cell phones and text messaging about Anna's baby to even think about being predjudiced. Careless, self centered, materialistic definately.
I have nothing against the younger iranians they seem to be good folks, but their group holding power I do take issue with. No one should ever want war. But if it comes to war between our nations, then as that young iranian man said, so be it and let our gloves come off and lets be done with it.
Its not always so easy to decipher good from bad in terms of governments or a nation's people. I do know this, I am proud to be an American. Having said this, I'm not always proud of our government's policies. This is our system and wrong or right there is one major distinction among our country and that of our enemies; the ability to peacefully disagree with the United States administration's policies without fear of the "moral police" or "religious mullahs" persecution. A nation that is not able to make a valid attempt to form a nation and government free from religious influence is doomed to fail. Where is the world Musslim outrage of the sectarian violence that plaques the Middle East? God Bless the USA!
Sure, the Iranian people voted in Amadinejad, but I've seen plenty of stories on the site that talk about the Iranian public, and even perhaps the Ayatollah who are tired of and angry at their president. Just as many in America voted for Bush, there are now plenty more who are tired of, and angry at him. I find the parallels between Iran and America, both in their respective populace and current regimes to be amazing. And while both heads of state can go on TV and say "We don't hate the American/Iranian people, we just don't like what their governments are doing", it somehow seems false, doesn't it?
they are TAUGHT to hate americans and jews from the FIRST day in school..it has been this way for generations so the blame CANNOT be put on our current administration no matter how the media portrays it.
Your article is excellent and should be required reading for Dick Cheney. A wise man once said, the cure for Iran is to leave them alone and let them enter, all by themselves, into the 21st century. That's what most of them want. Peace, not war, will let it happen.
As the reporter himself says about his report from Iran,"It's not really scientific." But that didn't matter to me. This was a well-written, easy to read news story. In a casual way, his unique observations between the clerics and the "regular people" (both young and old) gave me a better understanding of Iran more than any heavy-duty,full of facts, numbers and statistics news stories I've read before and gave up on half-way through because the reporter or commentator didn't know when he or she had made their point (s) and should have removed their fingers from their keyboards. Thank you, Mr. Williams.
If Iranians dont want the U.S. and its allies to attack then they should topple their government. Its as easy as that. Iran has a population of 68 million. If most of the country truelly doesnt follow the Islamic theocracy controlling Iran then they would have no problem gaining the freedoms they crave with a revolution. All I ever hear from persians, american iranians, and iranian sympathizers is that america doesnt understand the true feelings of the iranian people. If thats the case then solve your own problems or we will do it for you.
Common sense and human nature reinforce the likelihood that these anecdotal observations are a legitimate and accurate reflection of the average Iranian's take on the US. While it would satisfy the idle-minded and agenda-pushers to believe that "the media is lying to us" in this regard, I see no evidence to support that.
Charles. The party of Amadinazhad (sp) was largely defeated in recent local elections. Which shows that while he may be president that the people are getting sick of his one trick pony (hating the US). His country has its one problems and if he continues to pour money into military and nuclear facilities the country will fall apart and he will be defeated next election. Hopefully it will be before he has the capability of inflicting any real major damage. And Laura no one is going to war with Iran. We cant afford it and our military could not sustain it.
A very well written article, but an article focusing on a very small sub-group of the population, a group that is well informed of world events thanks to the internet. But I’d hardly call this representative of the population of Iran. We are not at war with Iran, radical Islam is at war with us. Unfortunately, it’s hard to separate the two from each other and if we do go to war with Iran it will be because of radical Islam.
Read Scott Ritter's book "Target Iran". Their president is a figurehead, the mullahs are in charge. A fatwa has been issued indicating they do not seek nukes. They are signatories of the Nuclear Non-proliferation Agreement and seek the same rights to nuclear power as all other signatories. We need to work with them and follow the rules of the agreement so that we know what they are up to. By continuing the same rhetoric we used on Iraq, we know less of what they are doing that we could. Keep an open mind and use diplomacy for a change. Quit using the Chamberlain reminder. Use caution and verification to ensure that mistake is never again made.
First the embassy hostage-taking (for over a year!) in 1979-81, then the murder of 250+ American UN-sposored peace-keeping troops in Beirut in 1983, then the arming and training of Hezbollah up to the present, now the nukes, and all the while mrdering dissidents and forcing a religion upon all citizens... Why have we permitted it to come to this, and how much longer must civilization await the removal of this barbarous disease-regime?
Its all well and good. That Iranians watch the Oscars, and play basketball. I mean, even Kim Jong-Il watches "Daffy Duck" re-runs. But, the fact is they have a government that's doing everything it can to kill Iraqis and Americans in Iraq. As well as Jews in Israel and God knows where else. While, they pursue nuclear weapons. So, the Iranians can wear the Yankee caps; and talk as much trash about the Mullahs as they want too. But, when push comes to shove. They have no power in that country. And are not doing anything, to get rid of the "mullahcracy."
I use to date a woman from iran she was insane like no other she loved america and hated iran government do to its government but as another person said earlier it is the fault of the people not government becuse the people make up the government. so i belive that 99% of iranians hate us they just say they do not becuase they are back stabbing as a group they are con artist and mainly terrorist due to being jelous of our way of life. think about it we helped them over throw their last king on the word of this new revoloutionnary government that they would give free oil to there people and to be afriend to the U.S after we helped them they took americans hostage jacked oil prices started funding major terror groups and cells and now attacks little countries like israel using other countiries to take the heat I ran is the biggest group of Whimps liars thieves and Crimminals. I don t think war is the answer like in high school if you wanted some one to stop bothering you you ignored them let them make a fool of them selves. I mean if the rest of the world does not see how insane and lazy these people are, ask them then to tell you when it became the norm to have a bunch of young to middel aged men who should be working making a living for their family instead are out jumping up and down sing chants agianst a country they blame for all there problems that they have had for the past 1000 years oh and it still is some how americas fault being that were only 231 years old.
well, thats a pretty picture you are painting, I guess this is supposed to give us hope for peace in the Middle East? please dont forget that these people may be wearing I love NYC baseball caps, but they sit idly by as their government supports terrorism and sectarian violence in neighboring countries. During segregation in America, it was not until people spoke out and stood up for civil rights that the government began listening and making changes. So unless the Iranians are willing to stand up to their government, nothing is ever going to change and their silence will continue to be an endorsement of terrorism and violence.
This opinion hasn't changed in the last 2000 some years,it's not going to change now!We have to face the prospect not everyone is going to like us;thats life.
Death to George Bush and the crooked US system. The US governmet has failed its peopleand has betrayed us all. This fake ass blog and its fake ass news. 9/11 was an inside job and the wrath of the people we get you soon!
Iran is like America ... you have a wide spectrum of citizens with a wide spectrum of opinions, beliefs and perspectives. Yet the leaders of any country should be held accountable for their actions.
It's really quite sad to see that open and even University-Supported events that promote death and murder because someone doesn't agree with someone else are legally allowed and perhaps even promoted. The mindset that killing someone because they disagree with you is ok leaves me with a sad view of Iran.
Iranians like what we have. The best weapon their government ( and most other Middle Eastern governments ) has is to conitinue demonzing America and Isreal. To argue that we have not done anything wrong is to miss the point, we are the ralling point the Iranian government uses to keep the publics eye off the Iranian governments ineptitude and opression.
wakeup for crying out loud. I find it hard to fathom so many humans still don't see other humans as the brothers and sisters they preach about on Sunday and are strangely shocked to hear of other humans that are like them.
Thank you so much for this entry. I think it is very important for the American people to know that the Iranian people are not our enemy, but a potential ally on the war on terror. It is important for our government to relax a bit and stop threatening Iran. Those who were in that mosque that day are blinded by hate, and any Americans that hate Iran as a nation for the foolishness of their president are also blinded by hate and intolerance.
Charles from Tampa, They didn't elect their government. Know before you tell.
DEATH TO GEORGE W. HE IS THE ONE WHO CAUSED ALL THE PROBLEMS. THE MIDDLE EAST IS NO DIFFERENT THAN USA. BRING BACK SLICK WILLY AND HILLARY
Everytime I see a group of Iranians (or any other group) chanting Death to America I feel they threaten me and my loved ones that live here and I feel justified in eliminating that threat as decisively and thouroughly as possible. I feel that the people that live there should know how us ordinary Americans feel and that they should pressure the idiots trying to incite violence toward us to stop.
I agree, that it is encouraging to hear that the general younger population is not as inflamed as their older counterparts. Not as rigid or hung up on proving their correctness---as the older counterparts in almost all governments appear to be, currently. Maybe there is quite a bit of hope for the future for us all. Living together, in acceptance and honor, of all of our differences and actually appreciating what they all bring into our world. Wouldn't that be an awesome thing? From a 56 year old former hippie.
Horse Pucky. That looney tune over there is who is president is blowing smoke to hide the goverments moral decline. They talk as though we americans are the devil, but I see your atricle said you seen things as Levis, NY yankee hats ect. Whats up with that? There administration is leading right to koas within and hopefully the good people of iran can get through this. The sooner the nut jobs that run Iran realize that there population wants to live in harmony with the world the better everybody will be. D. Carrier Redondo Beach, CA
ive grown up with iranians and iranian-americans, they are some of the most careing, funloving gracious people i have met. also to "charles", i dont think that the rest of the world holds americans responible for their government. i have lived and traveled abrod and most people understand the differance between what americans think and what their government does. Also, the US armed Saddam with weapons in the 80's, those weapons led to the death of over 500,000 iranians in the iran/iraq war, also the united states navy shot down a iranian passnger jet (iran air 655) in 1988 killin 299 people including 66 children. so i geuss some resentment is understandable. We Americans tend to forget these details and assume people in other countries hate us because we are wealthy and powerfull.
Why does Laura Shamblin think that all Americans are "blindly prejudiced", but no Iranians are? They see both sides of the coin, but Americans don't? Perhaps she needs to quit believing all that the media writes about America and Americans being evil and start belieiving that we are "real people...and are capable of seeing both side of the coin" also.
Our military and intelligence communities have really made a mess of things with Iran. I had numerous Iranian friends in college (the 1970s), and they developed great loyalty to our country and culture. Many met and married Americans and remained in the states. The capture of our embassy staff during the Islamic Revolution changed the attitude of Americans toward Iran, but we had been meddling in their governmental affairs for a long time creating anger toward our government. Needless to say, we currently have a window of opportunity that should be taken advantage of through the strength of our media/music/sports culture that could push through the ideals of a free society to mainstream Iranians. Just as many American servicemen and women who have served in Iraq have brought back elements of that culture home to the states, we can expand on our cultural of freedome in Iran. Throughout World War II, the United States and England published books and produced movies that were used behind German lines to promote resistence to the occupying powers, and other issues. The same should be done now ... not to overthrow the Iranian government for our purposes, but to overthrow the Iranian government so that the majority speaks for itself. Why can't we sneak in 1 million Ipods with songs like "We're not going to take it anymore," and others to push through political change in Iran? We could also transmit television images with similar programing to their satellite dishes. The Iranian people are obviously suffering under the current regime, and we can help turn their political history around with a slight nudge ... again, not for a takeover, but a positive change. As Ian Williams' story states, most Iranians like Americans on a personal level. I had college friends from Iran and Iraq, and if I were to see them again, I'm sure we would continue our friendships. Remember, whatever the country, we can all sing: "Hey Hey, my my, Rock 'n Rock Can Never Die!" to bring about change!
Charles you have the most sensible comment thus far, its really past time people take government to task. You want to be patriotic and nationalistic about your country but when you refuse to say truth to power other people in other country bundle you up as if we live in a monolithic society Whenever the silent majority continues to be silent the fewer minority gets to speak as if for all
With everything I have read it is pretty apparent Iran,s people are pro western and have been lied to by their government as we have. Their next election will tell what story is true. Our election showed the world we were not in agreement with our current government and we need to keep pushing back from the abyss. It takes a long time to turn a ship of this size and will take the people of Iran time also. Let us pary we have the time.
Thank you for writing this. I wish, however, that more American's would take the time to understand the world, and get out of the bubble in which they live. I've traveled for years now, and have lived in Arab countries, along with other Middle Eastern countries, and I've never felt safer, or more welcomed by people. What scares me is the people that have comments (see Mr. Sheeder) that do nothing to contribute to a constructive dialogue, and a rogue American government that still has a "Texas, yee-haw" mentality. Now, I've met many nice Texan's who aren't like that, but if what is happening now with Iran continues, the world will pay a dear price. Keep up the writing, I might just come on down and take a look around Tehran for myself!


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