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Dangers of the Baghdad plan

Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 10:36 AM
Filed Under:

Baghdad is a problem.

On a scale of one to ten, it’s an eight: one being a small Greek island in early September -- ten being Armageddon.

But today, for the first time, one of our stringers said, "I can’t wait until I get to Baghdad. It’s much safer."

I was slack jawed.

I don’t often hear the words "safer" and "Baghdad" in the same sentence. But this reporter lives in Baquoba, north east of here. Baquoba is a nine. Perhaps even and nine and a half.

"If I weren’t Sunni, I’d be dead. I’m 100 percent certain I’d be dead," he said as he handed me a tape that he’d smuggled in the ashtray of his car; reporters in the area now operate in secret.

Al-Qaida supporting Sunni gunmen have taken over large parts of the city and don’t like their pictures taken.

"They have driven out 90 percent of the Shiites in the area," he estimated.

Sectarian violence growing worse
I increasingly hear about entire villages being ethnically cleansed. Two weeks ago, we traveled to Saba al-Bor, a village north of Baghdad where Shiite militias have driven out nearly all of the Sunnis. The Sunnis are now on the outskirts of the town, lobbing in mortars, trying to drive out the Shiites. It’s a nine there too.

But our reporter today told me about a new strategy in the civil war used in a village called Hweidar near Baquoba.

Hweidar is a small Shiite village surrounded by Sunni towns.

"Do you know what the Sunnis are doing?" the reporter asked me.

"They are firing in mortars?" I suggested.

"That too… but what else?"

"Just tell me."

"They are cutting it off. They have cut the power lines and are even stopping food from entering. Now, the only way in for supplies is by bellum," he said.

A bellum is a traditional Iraqi riverboat used by fishermen and farmers. British forces used these round, flat-bottomed rafts during WWI to transport supplies during their march north to Baghdad.

American and Iraqi officials have now launched a major "Baghdad security plan."

But as our stringer reminded me today, Baghdad is only part of much wider problem.

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Karen Porter from PA I love your comments thank you This Bushy needs to be impeached right now
Ok, since the Dems have the power-- now what? Its like seeing a tour group of a broadway show. The cast memebers change-- but its still the same play. Face it, we were all dupped by this president and his cabinet-- way back when (remember the movie "Wag the Dog") because he made getting Sadam a personal issue-- with his "this is the man that tried to kill my dad" comment. Its like some crazy old western-- "Don't worry daddy-- I'll git 'im fer ya!" We had no logical reason to go into Iraq and everyone knows it-- but won't admit it. And now-- there's now logical way to get out. We, the people showed the powers that be what we thought about the way they've handled this-- and now what?? Nothing---not a thing. SO, it really doesn't matter what we say, now, does it??
Bush started this war without any provocation from Iraq. He continues to frighten the public with false but inflammatory comments not based in fact. Now he says we need to make another mistake to correct the previous ones. What we are all forgetting is that as religiously fervent we might be, the Sunni and Shia are more fervant. We must let them resolve this, even if we created the circumstance. Most importantly, nothing happening there cannot be controlled with diplomacy and compromise.
Collin Powell told Bush that if he invaded Iraq and he broke it he would ending up owning it. Well, he broke it and now the American People will pay for Bush's ignorance. It is time to impeach Bush.Jeff Bunkers
Richard, thank you for what you do and keep safe. People forget why we are fighting the cause, they have forgotten the reason why we are fighting terrorests. American people do not know how it is to live in those contries that have dictators that demand you to live there ways and religion or die. We have taken out a dictator (Sadam) that was killing his own people who needed to be stopped. Half the country have never liked bush because he is christain and follows moral ways of God and is a republican. Evil people must be punished and not let free to do what they want or they will get worse. If terrorests would of been delt with long ago we wouldn't have this problem. Fellow Americans do not forget those lost in the twin towers, they were inocent people that didn't deserve to die. I am praying for you Richard and everyone else that needs our support.
Hodge, do you think this mess isn't total chaos now? Did you read the UN report that states schools are closing, girls and women are not allowed to attend schools even if they were open? Is this the democracy you planned on? Most importantly who decided that the US was responsible for installing a Democracy in a foreign country in the first place? For pete sake our leadership thought the Iraq peoples would fall down and kiss the feet of the soldiers liberating them from Sadam and when that didn't occur they had no answers for what to do next. That is the reason that Iraq and Afghanistan are both worse today than they were 5 years ago.
I hate to disagree with everyone.. but its been a civil war for over a year now. We as a nation should not and cannot be involved in a civil war. IF that means leaving the iraq people to their fate... so be it! we as a nation have better things to do to prepare for the oncoming storm of violence around the globe and possibly here in america! Its time to help OURSELVES and rebuild our OWN nation!!!! what happened to amrerica first?? help someone else yet our own yard is gone to hell??? just some food for thought
It's Bush's nightmare. I'am sure he felt guilty every night.
Thank you Richard Engel for your excellent coverage of the situation in Iraq. What puzzles me is that there seems to no cohesive and comprehensive plan by the coalition forces to separate the Sunni and Shiite neighborhoods by buffer zones controlled by the allied forces. Allow sunnis living in Shiite zones a week to leave and enter Sunni policed areas. Likewise, Shiites returning to Shiite policed zones. Construction funds for new housing for the refugees should be provided by the USA and the United Nations. Buffer zones would be created by bulldozing areas, policed by coaltion forces, and strong restrictions of travel between zones. Each zone would establish it own local government system and provide at least one representative from each zone to vote in the parliament. Above all, plan to avoid civil war and ethnic cleansing carried out by death squads.
We are in the middle of the war for servival if pull out of Iraq it will be defeat to USA and will get very bad for us
This mess in Iraq will never improve. This is what happens when you attack a nation that has shown no violence toward us.....George Bush is in way over his head and is just to Czar like to admit it. The American citizens must respond to him..It is our country..Write your Congress reps and voice your displeasure to them.
THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, NO ONE KNOWS WHAT WILL HAPPEN IN IRAQ IF WE PULL OUT AND MAKE NO MISTAKE WE WILL BE PULLING OUT. WE WILL BE PULLING OUT BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW HOW TO FIX THE SITUATION THERE. THERE SEEMS TO BE SOME PRECONCEIVED NOTION THAT WE AMERICAN'S ARE BEST SUITED TO FIX ALL THE WORLD'S WOES. THE FACT IS WORLD HAS BEEN RESOLVING ITS ISSUES WITHOUT AMERICAN INTERVENTION SINCE THE BEGINNING OF MANKIND. TAKE RAWANDA FOR INSTANCE. AN ETHNIC CONFLICT FAR WORST THAN THE PRESENT SITUATION IN IRAQ. WITHOUT AMERICAS ASSISTANCE THEY RESOLVED THEIR ETHNIC ISSUES. HISTORY WILL SHOW YOU THERE WASN'T MUCH OF AN ETHNIC CONFLICT IN IRAQ UNTIL AFTER, WITH THE SUPPORT AND BACKING OF THE U.S. GOVERNMENT, SADDAM HUSSAIN ROSE TO POWER PRIMARILY AS AN ADVERSARY TO IRAN IN REPRISAL FOR THE HOSTAGE TAKING IN 1979. AT THAT TIME, ONLY THREE YEARS AFTER LEAVING VIETNAM, THE U.S. HAD NO STOMCAH FOR WAR. MY QUESS IS THAT THE IRAQS WILL EVENTUALLY RESOLVED THEIR ISSUES EVEN WITHOUT OUR IMPUT. LET'S REMEMBER, IRAQ IS THE CRADLE OF CIVILIZATION. THEY HAD ADVANCED FORMS OF GOVERNMENT WHEN EUROPEANS WERE LIVING A SAVAGE LIVE WITH NO FUNCTIONING FORM OF GOVERNMENT.
interesting blogs. However many of the arguments that are presented here are emotionally motivated. Think about whats happened. We went into a war with out just cause, we eliminated Sadam Hussein who by the way was keeping the peace in the entire region. Was he killing some of his people? yes he was but in all the years he was the leader less died than what has perished since we got involved 4 years ago. We disrupted the very fragile stability by the decisions made by the commander and chief plus his radical staff. Cheney, pearle, Rumsfeld, Rice, andf lets not forget the man who couldnt stop pushing for war against Iraq Wolfowitz. These people have been given rewards for their deciet and any one who voted for this regime is as responsible as they to come up with an answer. I served in this region twice and I had enough intelligence to know with out intelligence reports that once we occupied Iraq we would become responsible for the instability we caused w/o possibility of leaving with out the country collapsing. The current Bush government needs to be held accountable for this blunder and pay the consequences not the soldiers who have fought bravely.I personally would like to see those who have made alot of money from this war send their sons and daughters to to show their patriotism. So again any one who voted for the current dictator in Washington you are equally responsible for his mess and you need to come up with ideas on how to fix it. The rest of us voted against him that was our solution.
As an American, I do not care about another country and its democracy. Especially Iraq. Because Iraq is made of so many sects, Kurds, Shiite, and Sunni, that democracy for one would be subjugation for other. We will never establish unity in Iraq. Shiites believe they decended from Muhammad and should control the places that Muhammad created for Muslims, Mecca, and the sites he conquered in his life, Sunni's believe in imperial conquest of their own but not imperial occupatin from us, and Kurds want their portion of the oil and to live in peace. Our troops signed up to protect the Constitution at home and abroad, we have done neither because Bush & Co., is destroying our Constitutional guarantees while keeping us occupied with war. We don't belong in their civil war. We need to take care of home and our democray here. I don't care about their democracy, let them have their own civil war, like we did, to solve their own problem before we lose our country trying to save theirs.
Yeah, Richard is real brave sending out those stringers every day. Sitting in the hotel bar waiting for them to come back with stories he pays for. His biggest fear is that his stringer gets killed and he doesn't make his deadline.
This happens in almost every war. People will only stop fighting, Killing and dying until they are tired of doing all three. And from everything I've read of the Arab mentality this will take many decades, if not centuries. The US, by invading Iraq, and Al Queda, by taking advantage of the situation, have unleashed an evil that will not go back into the bottle in our lifetime....
Be sensible. do not expand the war in Iraq. No body wins. See 10 years back everyone outside US want to go to US. US was a hero in the mind of all third world including Arab and middle east young men. But now it is all changed. Why ? and for what ? Love brings back love. Respect human rights and dignity of others. Now the reason for attacking Iraq is over. No WMD, no more Saddam. Now let UN take the lead role and find a go forward for Iraq. Let the US and British forces be replaced by Third world and Arab forces which may bring back peace and stability. after that let a Democratically elected govt takeover. Let us not the hear the voice of violence clash of civilisations which brings only tears and sorrow. Save the US servicemen lives as well as Iraqi's. Continued presence of US and British forces in Iraq will only help who are against peace and strengthen the arguments of anti US forces in region. It is time for healing. No more wars please....
The West TOTALLY underestimates the role religion has in all this, thanks to "church-n-state-r-separate" woven into its political DNA (unlike the Middle East). The Sunni-Shia conflict dates back all the way to the 7th century, after Muhammad died....nothing new under the sun here. To have a sliver of a chance of stopping the sectarian violence, the USA has to intentionally frame all their discussions and solutions w/n the context of religion and the role of Islam...whether they like it or not.
The truly depressing news is that, while most Americans think that Baghdad is as bad as it gets, it's really a lot worse. At the same time, the misguided supporters of this invasion still think that it was not only the right thing to do, it's still the right thing to do. At least the Iraqis now have democracy. Unfortunately, democracy requires cooperation, commitment, and social stability. All of these are missing in Iraq. This is not a country of the people, by the people, and for the people. The Iraqis are not prepared for democracy. We should keep in mind that even the United States of America struggled to maintain its ideals through our own civil war. And here we are again struggling to maintain our ideals not through our own civil war but a civil war thousands of miles away in which we should never have been involved. But our ideals are again under attack from within, not by the enslavers of the South, but by an administration and its supporters who desire to scare us into sacrificing those ideals.
to richard engel: this is the best thing i've read re: iraq jon sarkin
I agree with the writer who says let the military decide what course is best in Iraq. However, General Casey has opposed the troop surge in Iraq. Bush does not listen to his military advisors and is ruining our military, our future security and killing thousands of people through his inept planning.
Richards report shows that the problem in Iraq is not only in Bagdad but encompasses the entire country. Sending more US targets to Bagdad will not secure Iraq. It is up to the Iraqi government to take over (with our training) and make the consessions they must to create peace in thier country.
we are not there for democracy. if we are, then why not china or rusia, or saudi arabia, or egypt or...... let's face it our texas oil tycon and his friends are out to secure AMERICA' future oil reserves, but i think we'll come out with something even better than oil. then all this is wasted. remember your neighbor will treat you the same so treat them well. think of what is going on in the mind of the world opinion when they find out about agent orange, guantanomo, turture on the airplane. even if we were there for democracy, we are sol.
THE LEFT DOES NOT HAVE TO COME UP WITH A SOLUTION. WE SHOULDNT BE THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE. WE MUST LEAVE NOW! THESE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN AT EACH OTHER FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS, AND IT IS NOT GOING TO END ANY TIME SOON. DIPLOMACY IS THE ONLY ANSWER. WAR JUST MAKES THESE PEOPLE RALLY TO THE CAUSE. THE LEFT SHOULD CONTINUE DOING WHAT ITS DOING. DENOUNCE THE WAR AND WATCH THE REPUBLICAN PARTY COLLAPSE AS IT IS DOING RIGHT NOW. BY THE WAY , HAS ANYONE SEEN OSAMA?
Unfortuneately all of the atrocities Saddam committed and his style of iron fist ruling is the only thing these people know and the only thing they will respond to. Introducing Democracy to these people is like giving your 16 year old kid the keys to a porshe and saying now try not speed out there. Ive been there. It takes more than saying stop, it takes a gun in there face and an attitude of I will to keep the Iraqis under wraps.
Mark- Get real! What aspiring democracy are you referring to? Aside from a few million iraqis falling into place during a well-choreographed election, nothing I have seen there even remotely smacks of a budding democracy, especially as we know it. Certainly for me, our government will need to disguise it's real intent, which is to establish a foothold in the Middle East, with a far more creative offering. And now that we're on the subject, why is it a "better alternative" be offered when illuminating the tragic mistakes associated with this invasion? Now that this travesty has been pretty much exposed for what it is, isn't saving additional American lives quite sufficent? The self-thinking patriot
Thanks for the honesty that you bring to the reporting; bringing us the inside look of the arabic perspective. Stay safe and be well.
The more I read about the mess in Iraq the more I feel absolutely convinced that Bush's decision to invade Iraq Will come to be viewed as the greatest strategic blunder that any American President has EVER MADE!!! There is simply no way to fix the troubles that he has unleashed!
Wow , give me a break Connie. It was God that got us into this war and now you say he will get us out. What a hypocritical thing to say. Remember Bush said a higher father told him to invade Iraq. It is in Bob Woodward's book. That statement has scared me more that anything else Bush does. By using this statement, he absolves himself of all liabilty and the dead are God's will. Facts do not matter when you have god's ear. No matter what evidence and facts you show Bush, all he has to say is god told him what to do and thus deny any accountability. So Ryan and Connie was Bush talking to your god . It is obvious you like war , because you belittle and berate anyone that talks against it. By the way Ryan, Democrats have a lot of ideas for the Iraq war, but Bush does not listen to anyone except your god. All I know is the god I pray to is loving and caring. It sounds like your god thrives on war and violence. I am sick of you right wingers that say liberals have no alternatives. What ever we purpose will be fought tooth and nail because Bush and you right wingers think you are smarter than the rest of us and you use god to justify any positon you want, facts be damned. Last time I checked democrats purposed the over horizon strategy that most general support, but Bush doesn't like it so end of debate. Democrats purpose dividing up Iraq into 3 sections,but Bush does not like it, so end of debate. Democrats purpose withdrawing troops, but Bush doesn't like it, so end of debate. Do you see a pattern here, Bush will not debate or explain his policies and positions but oppose all others if he does not agree. remeber God told him to invade Iraq, so any position he takes on Iraq , it is with his god's blessing. So he does not have to listen to the people, opponets, or advice, He has the ultimate trump card. God told me to do it.
Ryan in Chicago proves a point that has been proven time and again over the last several years. When the right is dead wrong they attack on a personal level because that is all they know how to do. This is not about right or left Ryan. This is about America. This about 21,500 more US Soldiers and Marines going to a foreign land to fight a failed policy. This is about a President and an Administration that speaks of democracy in a foreign country and all but wipes their feet on the one we have in our own country. I'm tired of partisan BS. We need to stand together as Americans or we will lose what is most precious to us and it will be our children that pay the price! WAKE UP AMERICA!!
Here's a bit of reality from a soldier over in Bagdad. "Iraq is a weird place, its where you have an ancient culture clashing with modern gagets and moralities in a place where people have been living since the dawn of mankind, all of which seems to be covered in trash. you remember all those commercials of the old guy talking about feeding kids for only pennies a day? well thats this place. you have little kids playing in the middle of a dump, surrounded by burning trash as they watch over their sheep, goats and cows. packs of wild dogs are everywhere, but for the sake of winning the hearts and minds the higher ups don't allow us shooting them. there are a bunch of really cool ancient buildings and monuments, stuff like that, and the bread that we get from various local bakeries near the police stations we visit is actually quite tasty. All in all though, what it all boils down to, is that have a group of people trying to fix a broken system, and it'd go somewhat smoothly if it wasn't for all the damn iranians and syrians coming in and causing chaos."
The U.S. is supposed to be a democracy, yet 75% of the population wants us out of Iraq, and still we send more troops in. This is Bushocracy at it's worse.
Irwin in woodland hills...thank you neighbor....well said.
Wow , give me a break Connie. It was God that got us into this war and now you say he will get us out. What a hypocritical thing to say. Remember Bush said a higher father told him to invade Iraq. It is in Bob Woodward's book. That statement has scared me more that anything else Bush does. By using this statement, he absolves himself of all liabilty and the dead are God's will. Facts do not matter when you have god's ear. No matter what evidence and facts you show Bush, all he has to say is god told him what to do and thus deny any accountability. So Ryan and Connie was Bush talking to your god . It is obvious you like war , because you belittle and berate anyone that talks against it. By the way Ryan, Democrats have a lot of ideas for the Iraq war, but Bush does not listen to anyone except your god. All I know is the god I pray to is loving and caring. It sounds like your god thrives on war and violence. I am sick of you right wingers that say liberals have no alternatives. What ever we purpose will be fought tooth and nail because Bush and you right wingers think you are smarter than the rest of us and you use god to justify any positon you want, facts be damned. Last time I checked democrats purposed the over horizon strategy that most general support, but Bush doesn't like it so end of debate. Democrats purpose dividing up Iraq into 3 sections,but Bush does not like it, so end of debate. Democrats purpose withdrawing troops, but Bush doesn't like it, so end of debate. Do you see a pattern here, Bush will not debate or explain his policies and positions but oppose all others if he does not agree. remeber God told him to invade Iraq, so any position he takes on Iraq , it is with his god's blessing. So he does not have to listen to the people, opponets, or advice, He has the ultimate trump card. God told me to do it.
I do not understand the "American" people today. I listen to all of our politicians and have become so disgusted with the political future of this country. My question is now and until I can get a really good answer, why don't we, the "American" people start letting our government know that their conduct is unacceptable. To remove our troops from Iraq and Afganistan will be disastrous for us as a country. None of us want to see our children coming home in a casket or wombed but what they are sacrificing is important to them and should be important to every American here in the United States.
Hey Mark,why don't you,George,Dick,Condi,and the neocons get on your white horses and clear the streets of Irag. Maybe the Sunnis,Shias,and the other criminals of Irag would be in awe of such a brave posse; they would raise their arms in surrender. However, I believe you are just another who is willing to send others to do your fighting for Democracy, ditto our present administration. If these mideast nations had no OIL they would be only a dot on the world maps; but sadly they have become the new killing fields for our young men and women. Why aren't the "sons" and "daughters" of our so called leaders fighting for Irag? I certainly agree that Rice has nothing to lose. Maybe her undying support for this war makes her the "Mother of War" and War George Bush's New World Order. To win this war we would have to be willing to destroy the Shia's and Sunni's militias and take on the whole Mideast Region. Do we really want to do that???
All the comments posted are exactly what make America the best country in the world. If you were an Iraqi and made your feelings known, you would probably be dead now. The complexity of the Middle East is something that most Americans do not understand. Their way of thinking is positively barbaric. Things were tolerable until they decided to kill Americans. The same people who are complaining about the President would be the same people who to complain when the terrorist start to kill Americans in downtown USA. When that happens, these same people would be demanding that the President do something. As distasteful as it sounds, it is better to fight in Iraq than in the continental USA. The American way of life is worth defending and must be defended. Keep an eye on the larger picture. The extremist in the Middle East wants us dead. There is no compromise or negotiating with them. The world is running out of options. We need to kill them all and nurture the rule of law.
Interesting, we don't hear enough about what is happening outside of Baghdad. I did read one article about life in one Kurdish area that sounded pretty rosy. I imagine there must be other areas outside of Baghdad that are flourishing, but then again who knows, perhaps that other article was BS. Anyway, I think if I could suggest anything to the people commenting on this blog, it's to take all the things you see/read/hear about (especially from mainstream media outlets, such as MSNBC) with a grain of salt. Do any of us TRULY believe that their articles (at the very least, the selection of their articles) are without bias? If you do, you shouldn't. Fox is your right-wing outlet, NPR/PBS are your left-wing outlets, and everybody else is somewhere in the middle; but on any given topic they all lean towards whichever direction will bring in the most viewers/readers/listeners. In this light, I think it's pretty obvious that Iraq has become unpopular very much on it's own, and thus the media presents it in as bad a way as possible. As we should all easily recall, not long ago the war was in fact quite a bit more popular. That was a time when you heard many more excuses for Bush, and war-bashing was left to "Democracy Now." And now to the editorial... We don't need to do something like increase our forces there because 'otherwise we'd be quitters and losers.' We need to quit worrying about our image, and do whatever needs to be done to return peace to that region. If they want to establish democracy after that, so be it. But we stirred this monster, and now we need to put it to bed. Unfortunately, Bush seems to think he knows how to do it, but any person with a clue knows he really doesn't. And when it comes down to it... regardless of the fact that we are still in the midst of the war, regardless of the fact that the war had near unanimous support from the House and Senate, regardless of any other argument... Bush, Cheney, Powell, Rice, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, etc. all LIED to start this thing. The war is it's own entity at this point, what happens to it needs to not be tied to the fate of a bunch of lying, power hungry politicians. We must do what's best for our men and women overseas and for the Iraqi people, but don't let these scoundrels get away with their crimes. They should ALL be impeached, if this country still believes AT ALL in the laws governing the executive branch.
I support our troops 100% and think about them every day. When a soldier goes to war, he can't be involved in politics. He can't fight a war based on his personal opinions or beliefs. An army would be self-destructive if each soldier fought or didn't fight depending on how he feels about it. These troops do their job the way they were taught and ask no questions. It's the only way. But it is their leaders at the highest levels that make the decisions that can mean life or death for these soldiers and Marines. In the case of Iraq, Bush is responsible for what these trops do over there. He has decided that this fight is worth a certain amount of American lives. The soldiers will fight because that is their job. And some will die. Is it worth it? Is it worth an American life to stay the course one more day? I say no. Adding more troops will only increase the possibility of more U.S. casualties. It's time to wean the Iraqis off of us. Slowly, but steadily. Stop putting our troops at risk when it isn't necessary. Or send them to Afghanistan if you want to do more good than harm. We are losing ground there that was paid for in American blood. This is where we should concentrate the war on terror. Saddam is dead, George. You got him. Now let's "cut" our losses there and "run" down Bin Laden. He's next on everyones list. Don't waste another week in Iraq. Admit your mistake and save a few soldiers and Marines. They are the important thing here. They trusted Bush to go to war and he mis-used them. All I have left to say is, "George...snap out of it"
Ok Ryan, Bush did not 'create' the tension between the different factions in the middle east- the tension isn't even really between us and them anymore-they have hated eachother forever -no matter what our intensions began as- Bush cannot stop the different factions from hating eachother and our being there DID allow this to explode into a civil war -we cannot make them respect eachother, we cannot make them be fair in their politics to all sides-- half the time we barely do that here. The difference is they kill eachother to solve their differnces -and their doing it with our guys in the middle dying everyday for people who do nothing to make it any better for themselves. So How Long?? How many of our guys have to die for people who think dying is noble. The USA fought a civil war and survived - Vietnam did came out of thier war after we left as well, and unlike the predictions the whole world did not fall into communism when we left. And the world will not fall to the terrorists if we leave Iraq either. Al-quida is every where, every corner of every country, You can't defeat terrorism, because as long as people are willing to blow them selves up for what THEY see as a just cause it wil continue. Bush said it himself - "victory will not look like the victories in the wars of our fathers", and thats becasue we will never completely be victorious and he knows it, right now he's just to stubborn to admit he was wrong.
The U.S. needs to develop its own sort of "bellum strategy". How much does the U.S. pay Haliburton corp. for a mortar round? An amazing amount of food, clothing and other essential goods and services can be bought for the ailing Iraqi citizenry for what the war is costing. The thing is, we're so attached to using all of this sophisticated weaponry, and, on an enemy we can't any longer even clearly distinguish. True humanitarian service is what's needed here. Then, even the most brazen of Iraqi citizenry would HAVE to think more kindly of us (U.S.), then worst of them if only reluctantly surmising that we aren't the hypocrites that we've been making ourselves out to look. Iraqi's enmasse begin getting their own good ideas on seeing the light at the end of their own tunnel and move forward with it. And what do we get out of it? We get the honor of triumph bestowed upon us, the world community once again smiling at the American dream. We've brought our boys back home to Mom and some well deserved Apple Pie.
As Mark, from Chicago, stated, I too fear for this country – and have for quite some time now. Not because of the “shallow and shortsighted debates” presented by the news media but rather because of those presented by blind, neo-con acolytes like him! He states that “the elected government of Iraq” are not the bad guys. I’m sorry, what “shallow and shortsighted” media reports has he been following?! Are you not aware, sir, that al-Maliki has and retains power only because al-Sadr, possessor of one of Iraq’s largest Iranian-backed Shiite militia/death squads, gave it to him – and supplied a few of his Cabinet members as well?! That al-Maliki is, himself, not only a Shiite Muslim but also a member of the political party founded by al-Sadr’s own FATHER?! That he remains in power in large part by protecting al-Sadr’s militia from the “bad guy cleansing” efforts of the US military, a stance quite obviously in direct opposition to our needs and objectives there? Are you aware, sir, of the complex realities on the ground in a country like Iraq, where factional differences, religious divisions, tribal and family relations combine to weave an almost unrecognizable fabric of “sort of good guy” vs. “sort of not real bad guy” in a cacopheny of grey zones where nothing is quite as apparent as it first may seem? That nothing in this world, my dear, is as “black and white,” “good guy vs. bad guy” as both you and other blind followers of the rhetoric of this administration seem to want to believe. I know it may be a little harder to figure things out that way, a little tougher to tell the “good guys” from the “bad guys,” a little more difficult to continue to believe that your side is always on the side of the “good guys,” but give it a shot.
That's quite a fan club you got there Richard Engel. Asking the Lord to keep you safe. You're work is exceptional.
bush did 9/11 to get us INTO Iraq, so if anyone thinks he ever intends on leaving Iraq is delusional. And please don't start calling me a conspiracy nutcase before opening your mind and then your eyes to the overwhelming evidence supporting that "theory". I implore everyone to watch the Google videos of "911 Press for Truth", "Loose Change 2nd Edition", "911 Mysteries", "911 In Plane Sight", "Freedom to Fascism", "Terror Storm". Google "9/11 Truth" and see what you find. Are you all aware that a third WTC bldg collapsed on 9/11? It was WTC 7 which collapsed for NO reason and has since been rebuilt. It's not mentioned in the 9/11 Commission report. Lee Hamilton on the Commission even says they were set up to fail. Read about the neo-cons and the PNAC and their need for a "new Pearl Harbor" to accomplish their goals. Investigate the TRUTH and then tell everyone you know to do the same before this insane SOB in the White House causes more catastrophe!
This is a religious/political war with no end in sight. Not even 100,000 more American troops would be able to help put an end to this blood shed. What is most unfortunate is that this situation will shape our childrens future unlike anything we have seen. We have set this world up for continual distruction. I hope money, oil and power were worth it all. My heart gopes out to the innocent Iraqi people that are now stuck in a state of total dispare. This wieght will be on the shoulders of ALL Americans. I am ashamed that we as the people of America voted this president in for a second term. What a shame! He has ruined our country in the eyes of all Middle East for eternity. There is no going back now.
President Bush is doing a good job, We need to stay their , Also I believe they need to reinstate the draft not only for the guy but women to, They need to fight for their country and not complained about it. I would gladly goes if they would take me and I am a women
Long before Bush became President, many in the middle east hated America. To say that he is to blame completely misses the real issue at hand - which is the fact that America has what they want, including freedom, stability, and wealth as a nation. However, they do not want these things with the opposing groups in power. The impending civil war was going to happen whether the president ordered the Iraq war or not. The real blame should be placed on the power hungry and money hungry clerics and militia leaders that are all positioning for power. Remember - Iraqis are killing Iraqis not because of hate of America, but because of their own evil interests.
TO the the first comment.... It is the US (Bush) who has never offered a HONEST analyses what will happen after you will INVADE Iraq. Taht should have never happen. Iraquis were much better off under Saddam - honestly, there was maybe opression, but there was food, schools and more-less clean environmnet. Now there is nothing, people are leaving at a rate of 150,000 per month, and being killed by hundreds a day, not 32,000 officially dead in 2006, but many more masacred by the US "shock and awe" game.....uranium depleted ammunition, phosphorus bombs and other "garbage". You have not brought freedom, but tortured and masacrted the population...Why do you not use the A-Bomb, and get rid of them all? Than there may be a peace....
I feel as an American, that my hands are tied. Part of me still cannot understand exactly why we went there in the first place, and another part of me believes the reason was'nt for the weapons of mass destruction, but to secure oil. Still, I think the cost of life, to justify lower gas prices, is disgusting. Change is needed in America, not just at the helm, but accross the board. How can we as Americans, continue to sit still, and watch our country crumble around us. Reform and amending the way everything is done, is just the right step in the right direction, but first....bring back our men and women, and instead of shipping them to other countries, to protect thier freedom, keep them here, on our boarders, and in our cities, to keep our freedom safe. President Bush is the biggest mistake we have ever made as Americans, 9-11...He was in a school full of children, when his office knew that something was about to happen...a third world rulers way of hidding!! As good as Saddam himself!! Bush should have been on the White House steps, with his fist in the air!!!! Thats the President I want...a man not afraid to truely stand up against the evil in this world!!!
Despite all the bickering and name calling, i'm glad to see an honest discussion of the subject. Having grown up in an authoritarian regime under a dictator who ruled with an iron fist, i believe i can offer a bit of insight and first hand experience to this discussion. Josip Broz Tito ruled Yugoslavia until his death in the early 1980's. He managed to quash centuries of ethnic strife through torture, intimidation, and a police state. After his death, the country splintered among ethnic lines and mass rape and slaughter on an unprecedented scale occured. Saddam employed similar methods, yet somehow we naively believed that removing him from power would yield different results. We would be ushered in as "Liberators"! Democracy is a process. It isnt a product that can be packaged and shipped off for consumption. It took many years and much bloodshed for our country to get to where it is now. What gave us the right to try to force democracy on peoples who still live and function along tribal ties? We could surge another million troops and never manage to get ourselves out of the hole we have dug. As soon as we pull out, all hell will break loose. Much accusation seems to be going around, "If u dont support staying the course, offer a better solution!" When will we come to the realization that the time for solutions, surges, political resolutions is long gone?


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Fight for Iraq
Learn more about the ethnic, religious and political power plays in and around Iraq during a briefing of the region led by NBC’s Richard Engel.